Hopefully, the Decline of Year-Round Outdoor Markets with Locally Grown Produce Will Help Americans Not Be Such Fat Fucks

The AP has an interesting piece on the difficulties facing year-round food markets dedicated to locally grown stuff. Snippets:

In colder climates, it's virtually impossible to maintain a year-round flow of locally grown fruits and vegetables. That means that produce dwindles or has to be trucked in from far away - which goes against the locally grown ideal.

Public markets have also struggled to find a balance between selling raw ingredients and prepared food. Fresh produce, meat, fish, dairy and poultry distinguish a market from a food court. But Americans are geared toward a grab-and-go system, and prepared food is enticing to vendors because it has a far higher profit margin.

"If you go to a public market in Europe or Latin America, it is very difficult to find something to shove in your face and eat," said Wendy Baumann, who was one of the founders of the Milwaukee Public Market, which has weathered significant vendor turnover since it opened in 2005 and now emphasizes prepared foods. "You can't be all to all."

The nationwide growth of seasonal, outdoors farmers' markets, which in most climates run from early spring until mid-fall, provide fierce competition for customers and vendors.

"All the good vendors are already stretched thin," said Charlie Hertel, who was selling heaps of luscious late-summer peppers and melons from his Forest Grove, Ore., farm at a recent farmers' market in downtown Portland. "And as I read the mission, customers are attending the market to meet the farmer, not a middleman."...

Markets can't have too many handicrafts vendors, he said, because they create a flea-market feel.

More here.

Thank god for supermarkets. And the UglyRipe Tomato!

Ron Bailey recalls life on the farm while attending to Barbara Kingsolver's phoney-(organic) baloney idyll about eating only what you grow.

Katherine Mangu-Ward hips us to how the upper crust eats (ethically!) and bellies up to the table for a year of magical eating.

Neil Steinberg on a week of eating dangerously.

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  • A taco vendor.||

    "If you go to a public market in Europe or Latin America, it is very difficult to find something to shove in your face and eat,"

    Aren't street foods a universal trait of civilization?

  • ||

    "In colder climates, it's virtually impossible to maintain a year-round flow of locally grown fruits and vegetables. That means that produce dwindles or has to be trucked in from far away - which goes against the locally grown ideal."


    And when the crops failed that year, you starved. For most of human history mankind faced the prospect of being one bad harvest away from starvation. Then, thanks to the industrial revolution and globalization, that threat ended for nearly all of the world.

  • JasonL||

    There is a year round farmer's market about a mile from my house here in KY. It's great for corn during the season, but the rest of the time it has a lot of gourds and little else.

  • VM||

    f you go to a public market in Europe or Latin America, it is very difficult to find something to shove in your face and eat,...

    well. That's simply not true. Naschmarkt, auch hier

    Karmelitermarkt (you can get horsemeat there, by the way. You can grab a bier and wurstl there, too. Or a sandwich or whatever.)

    Landstrasser Markt

    enjoy a kebob sandwich, wurstl, bier, kartoffelpuffer - all of it eat-on-the-way.

    or on the world's longest pedestrian walking and shopping street, Strøget in Copenhagen. Good places to grab a dog as you walk along.

  • robc||

    While it wasnt a market, I remember from when I lived in Switerland, the local butcher would close at 5 PM (or maybe 6). He would then fire up the grill in front of his place (it was on a pedestrian street/plaza thing) and sell brats and etc.

    After work, when I would go to the grocery, I would grab a brat for the bus ride home.

  • ||

    Sorry for the threadjack here, but I just made a donation to you-know-who. Today's the day! But I am unable to see the ticker of how much is going in. Can someone post an update from time to time? Thanks.

  • src||

    Yeah, street food is universal; falafel stands, herring on the beach, "Frankies" in Bombay.

    I think the intended point was that the European model distinguishes between places to buy food (fruit/vegetable markets, butchers, bakeries) and places to buy things to eat.

    I don't especially agree with the backlash against the locally grown foodie movement. Sure, fancy food is a luxury. But it's actually a valuable and enjoyable luxury; a real apple or a real tomato is infinitely better than the bred-for-shelf-life variety. If you can get it, why not appreciate it?

  • ||

    Karmelitermarkt (you can get horsemeat there, by the way. You can grab a bier and wurstl there, too. Or a sandwich or whatever.)

    What is this, a market for ants?

  • ||

    In Tours, France there was a public market on Wednesdays and Sundays, and there would be a cart with the most delicious pastries and croque baguettes, which they would heat up for you so you could enjoy them at the time. You could even buy a can of seven up to have with it. They also had small gourmet pizzas.(incidentally, it's not called "sept-up," but rather a hideously pronouced "seven-up")

    Also, most towns had some form of outdoor pastry vendor that was open daily.

    In France, however, it's generally frowned upon to eat in non-restaurant public places, but I guess they make a few special exceptions.

  • robc||

    sage,

    I just made my 1st donation. Last night about 8, the total was at 2.9M, now its at 4.1M

    So, over $1,000,000 today already.

    Happy Guy Fawkes Day!!!!

  • ||

    It's not produce that makes people fat; on the contrary, if more people ate produce they'd probably lose weight.

    It's much more likely that increased consumption of packaged "food" and sedentary lifestyle is to blame for creating a nation of fat, dumb, pliable sheeple.

  • VM||

    src - but as several of us have pointed out, that's simply not the case in the examples we have provided. Naschmarkt, Landstrasser Markt and Karmelitermarkt all have produce, raw meats, flour, grains, veggies, etc. AND you can grab something to eat along the way.

    The one in Haarby, Denmark was really cool, where you could get fantastic herring sandwiches as you examined the amazing produce!

    Taktix:
    hier in Vienna. In the Second District, a place with tons of history.

    "a real apple or a real tomato is infinitely better than the bred-for-shelf-life variety." that's your taste preference. it may not be absolute.

  • ||

    robc, thanks! And the day is young.

  • R C Dean||

    "All the good vendors are already stretched thin,"

    Translation - the free market has already addressed this issue. Further hectoring and/or subsidies from Our Betters not needed.

    The Demand Kurv Rules All!

  • ||

    @ VM,

    I was just making fun of the small size of the linked picture in a Zoolander-esque manner, as in "What is this? A school for ANTS?!?"

  • CEH||

    I lived in France - not Paris or Marseilles or Cannes, but Herouville. The place was no tourist trap, neither was the small town I worked in, Mezidon. There weren't street vendors climbing over one another to sell me a Kabob or a crepe (stuffed with Nutella and bananas), like there are in those other places. And still, it was as easy to stuff my face in France as it is in Springfield, Illinois, my hometown, where we invented the Corn Dog, the drive through window, and the horseshoe sandwich.

    But that's just one man's story.

  • ||

    I am always amused by the 'buy local' movement since it really only works in climates that you can actually grow stuff year round. Which leaves out most of the US. And if it is grown locally in the northern climates its grown in massive green houses which require lots of energy to run not making them -lets say- 'green'.

    I also noticed last week that many of the vendors at my local farmers market were selling the exact same tomatoes that my local supermarket stocks - those that come from south america. And they are cheaper at my supermarket.

  • Jesse Walker||

    The best thing about the Baltimore City farmer's market is the pre-prepared foods -- local hot-sauce companies, a family that makes tamales, stuff like that. And trust me, no one's going to mistake that place for a food court.

  • Episiarch||

    Go to La Boqueria in Barcelona if you want to get your mind blown by an unprepared (mostly, cheese and jamon are "prepared" in reality) food market. Just the selection of fish alone is astounding.

  • VM||

    Taktix:

    ooh. hrumph. Was actually linking it to the ferris wheel scene in "The Third Man"... hrumph. And since the market is right 'round the corner from the wheel, it made sense. At least in this citizen's twisted mind. hrumph.

    /kicks spongebob costume

    CEH - when you lived in France did you run into a really cool Marine/ Engineer/ Journalist with a strong interest in history who's married to a very pretty, intelligent Jewish lady. I think his name is Jean Bart...

    (and since you're in our capital, could you please make a face at Gov Chicagovich and his crooked cronies?)

    greetings from Chicago. :)

  • ||

    I am always amused by the 'buy local' movement since it really only works in climates that you can actually grow stuff year round.

    Or else, the market could just shut down in October and reopen in the spring like in does in almost every northern town.

    BTW, don't confuse buying produce in season at a farmers market with buy local / eat local. The first is done by tens of millions of Americans who just want to buy fresh food. The second set of behaviors is semi-annoying foodies who obsess about crap that no one else does.

    I also noticed last week that many of the vendors at my local farmers market were selling the exact same tomatoes that my local supermarket stocks - those that come from south america. And they are cheaper at my supermarket.

    You have a really shitty farmers market. My condolences.

  • ||

    Same as it ever was.

    Progress always starts with counter-cultural absolutists removing themselves completely from the mainstream economy, if only as an experiment. The best innovations then become more and more popular until they come to be adopted by the mainstream.

    The points raised by the buy local movement remain valid, even if people don't choose to live like the Unabomber.

  • jimmydageek||

    "If you go to a public market in Europe or Latin America, it is very difficult to find something to shove in your face and eat,"



    Where does this lady get this information? She needs to venture out of Milwaukee a little.

  • technomist||

    Last time I was in California my wife and I drove past field after field of artichokes. Stop in any town, look in and supermarket and were they on sale? No. Wal-Mart were stocking tinned artichokes (from Spain, if I recollect their origin). They weren't on the menus of any local restaurants either.

    The situation, in a way, was as pathetic as driving across Manchuria the same year when the watermelons are for sale -farmers at every road junction trying the sell the same products with no value added. They couldn't give them away.

    I don't have the answers, but maybe your farmers, or their relatives, could learn to cook?

  • Mike Vick||

    Good places to grab a dog as you walk along.

    Damn, I gotta get myself to Denmark.

  • Kolohe||

    I don't especially agree with the backlash against the locally grown foodie movement ... If you can get it, why not appreciate it?

    src, as has been said above, it's not the preference, it's the smug. And, while this may be a straw man, (because I may be confusing marketing for evangelism) but it seems to me that the local foodie movement wants everyone to this, and not just serve as another alternative.

  • ||

    Yeah, all-culture-war-all-the-time explains it.

    You know who shops are farmers markets? Hippies, college professors, and people who they're better'n you.

    Real Americans buy what the television tells them.

  • ||

    Oh Joe if only you were so understanding of other alternative lifesytles like gun owners and evangelicals. To give these people some benefit of the doubt, surely no one is dumb enough to beleive that people should only eat food grown locally? Surely right? I hope I am right about that.

  • thoreau||

    Why are all these consumers making decisions based on their individual preferences? Why don't they just let the market decide what they eat?

    :)

  • Episiarch||

    Real Americans buy what the television tells them.

    Real Americans buy what joe tells them.

  • x,y||

    I made a donation today too sage. And I also can't see the $ ticker. Hopefully, someone will blog this later.

  • ||

    I've never fully grasped Reason's sneering hatred of farmer's markets, etc. Are they a bit precious? Yep. Is that a crime? Not so far as I'm aware. They mostly seem to be an outgrowth of consumer sentiment, which I was under the impression was something Reason liked.

    The antagonism seems based mainly on the more overreaching claims of local food and organic food movement advocates. But this is shooting fish in a barrel.

    Couple of related points:

    1) Does the industrial food system really need this spirited defense? Presumably people won't starve to death in order to satisfy their yen for in-season pesticide-free radicchio, so perhaps the market will provide a better bulwark against Barbara Kingsolver's onslaught than a thousand snarky blog posts.

    2) Does anyone here really think that the industrial food system is even worth defending? It's not exactly a paragon of free-market virtue. On the contrary, it's a hideously distorted, fucked up market with insane amounts of negative externality. I get it: if not for the green revolution, billions would have starved to death. But that's not really what we're talking about here in the States, is it?

    3) Aren't posts such as this based on the strawman argument that a sizeable number of people actually want to dismantle the industrial food system? Farmer's markets are a luxury good. Nothing more, nothing less. Most of the yuppies who shop there (myself included) also happily hit the supermarket on the way home to pick up some Heinz 57 to put on that grass-fed chuck.

    So, by all means, keep hammering away on this topic. But...what's your point exactly?

  • VM||

    "Progress always starts with counter-cultural absolutists removing themselves completely from the mainstream economy, if only as an experiment."

    certainly - Galileo bucked the trend. Think of musicians. Mr. Tucker did. (I'm not reading your comment as being a part of the culture war; I'm understanding it as people who are separate from mainstream mechanisms and aren't affected by them, choose not to be affected, or want to try something. Like living at Walden Pond)

    I think you nail the "technology uptake curve" elements of this issue quite well.

    Similarly to this town in Australia.

    You get people who, for whatever reason, try something else, it works, others catch on, and it eventually becomes commoditized. Or it falls by the wayside. Or it just gets added to the fat tails.

    Doktor T: clearly you were in the quad listening to the Spin Doctors and kicking the hacky sack instead of attending EKONOMIKS 79. Shame. It just goes to show that you're obviously used to teaching complete novices who, despite their tyro status, have better understanding of the material than you.

  • robc||

    Barrel fish is the tastiest.

  • ||

    Actually, farmer's markets are typically cheaper for comparable products. Fewer middle men.

    But since they're ideologically incorrect, it's useful for the haters to cast them as elitist.

    Which would surprise the people in my city who use their EBT cards there, but whatever.

  • Thomas Paine\'s Goiter||

    total raised today: $1,253,408

  • ||

    If something you find ideologically threatening is widely popular, you call it an example of tyranny of the majority.

    If it is uncommon, you deride it as elitist.

    Sometimes, you can find the same commenters switching back and forth on the very same thread.

  • robc||

    I prefer random N Georgia interstate exit back of truck peach purchases to farmers markets. The best peaches I have ever had have been purchased that way.

    Screw centralized locations, just set up wherever.

  • ||

    Adam,

    You make good points. Make no mistake about it, local food markets are an elite luxury. Good for the people who shop there. If it makes them happy, what is not to like? I think the snarky blog posts result from the perception that the people who shop there really think they are making a difference in the world or that this model could in anyway replace industrialized agriculture without mass starvation.

  • thoreau||

    Actually, we need a study to find out if barrel-shot fish cause diabetes.

    But make sure they're local fish. Or at least shoot them in your own backyard.

  • Mike Laursen||

    Last time I was in California my wife and I drove past field after field of artichokes. Stop in any town, look in and supermarket and were they on sale? No.

    techomist, they are available. You gotta know where to go to buy them.

  • thoreau||

    Hey, I buy all my food at the Stater Bros across the street.

    joe can be happy that I'm not burning any gasoline. Libertarians can be happy that I'm buying from a corporation.

    Cathy Young can be happy that I managed to please both sides.

  • Thomas Paine\'s Goiter||

    The antagonism seems based mainly on the more overreaching claims of local food and organic food movement advocates.

    It's based more on the buy local sentiment, which is nothing more than mercantilism.

  • Thomas Paine\'s Goiter||

    total raised today: $1,305,858

  • ||

    Thanks, TPG. I'm watching here, ya heard.

  • ||

    Like most movements, the effort to expand local purchasing is about MORE, not ALL.

    The people who've done the experiments of only buying local are experimenting, to see how much and what types of purchasing are easy, and which are harder.

    As more people want to buy local, there will be more money to be made providing it, and people who are interested will have more options to do so, which will in turn get more people to choose more local goods.

    Where does it stop? 100%? 75%? 50%?

    Who cares?

  • robc||

    As fuel prices rise, buying local should happen, just because it should be cheaper due to transporation costs. A KY grown tomato ought to be able to undersell a CA grown tomato or a South American grown tomato. If it cant, it probably makes more sense to by the CA or SA grown one.

  • robc||

    Replace KY with your state as appropriate.

  • VM||

    Dammit Doktor T:

    I looked at my gun, and it went off, sending a shower of HFCS onto Division street, where, incidentally, there's a local market every Sat morning.

    See? It's all connected.

  • ||

    I think there's some confusion between farmer's markets and general public markets.

    Farmers markets are generally unprepared produce, local meats, and locally prepared goods (sauces, pastries, etc.). Food is generally kinda expensive because it taps a niche market. Where else are you going to go to find fresh kale in New England?

    At public markets, vendors usually come from miles around to sell goods without the middleman, so you can get 3lbs of tomatoes for $2 instead of 1lb for $3 at the grocery store. A lot of the food at them is overstock, or bulk in quantity (I once got a 10lb bag of onions for $1). Food origin ranges from South America to 10 miles away. You can sometimes find farm wineries, hats, and mangos all in the same place.

    For one example of a good public market, check out the Rochester Public Market
    http://cityofrochester.gov/PRHS/PublicMarket/index.cfm

  • Thomas Paine\'s Goiter||

    total raised today: $1,362,667

  • ||

    TPG,

    What was the Q4 total at 12AM? I thought I checked last night and he had yet to eclipse $3M. But I was drinkin a little...

  • VM||

    Hay joe - do you know this group, and if you do, what has your experience been with them or what do you think?

  • Jesse Walker||

    I've never fully grasped Reason's sneering hatred of farmer's markets, etc.

    I like farmer's markets. Entrepreneurship, consumer choice, good food -- I'm for all those things.

  • ||

    TPG,

    Nevermind. Dave W. just posted the answer.

  • ||

    VM,

    Never heard of them.

  • Mike Laursen||

    I think there's some confusion between farmer's markets and general public markets.

    Must be an East Coast thing to distinguish between the two. Here on the West Coast, we just have farmer's markets.

  • ||

    As more people want to buy local, there will be more money to be made providing it, and people who are interested will have more options to do so, which will in turn get more people to choose more local goods.

    Where does it stop? 100%? 75%? 50%?

    Who cares?


    joe's a free market capitalist! ;-)
    joe's a free market capitalist! ;-)

  • Mike Laursen||

    Processed foods, handicrafts vendors, it's all good. But please for the sake of the children, ban the creepy clown making balloon animals.

  • ||

    Must be an East Coast thing to distinguish between the two. Here on the West Coast, we just have farmer's markets.

    You're right, the term distinction might just be my own experience, but I was mostly trying to point out that there are at least 2 common models by which farmers/public markets operate, and that it was important to differentiate between the two when commenting.

  • Mike Laursen||

    I am always amused by the 'buy local' movement since it really only works in climates that you can actually grow stuff year round. Which leaves out most of the US.

    True, but where it does work, it's a great free market choice to have.

  • ||

    J sub D,

    One doesn't have to be a market fundamentalist to be a capitalist.

    I'm a capitalist, just like FDR, JFK, and Robert Reich.

  • thoreau||

    I'm a capitalist, just like FDR

    joe, you can say what you want in defense of that statement, but you know damn well what the response will be. That's basically the definition of trolling.

    WTF?

  • ||

    "Mike Laursen | November 5, 2007, 11:00am | #
    Last time I was in California my wife and I drove past field after field of artichokes. Stop in any town, look in and supermarket and were they on sale? No.

    techomist, they are available. You gotta know where to go to buy them."

    Good Point. Its my mistake for not knowing where to find them or for expecting to see them advertising.

    As the farmers didn't seem to be literate enough to write signs up as I drove past for me to see the artichokes, why don't they gather together in one place where I can go to find them. Lets call such a gathering place a 'market', or as it would be one inhabited by farmers, a 'farmers market'.

  • Episiarch||

    I'm a capitalist, just like FDR

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    (wipes tears from eyes)

  • ||

    thoreau, if anything, I was trolled myself.

    Although based on Episiarch's "thoughts," I guess I'm just as much of a class traitor.

  • Mike Laursen||

    Farmer's markets. We really do have those. Honest. I don't know how it works in other places, but here in Northern California they cycle through a bunch of suburban locations, on a weekly schedule.

    And I'm really surprised you didn't encounter any roadside produce stands. It's really common to find them wherever there is farming.

    Sounds like you just happened to end up in all the wrong places.

  • Franklin Harris||

    In colder climates, it's virtually impossible to maintain a year-round flow of locally grown fruits and vegetables.



    Hell, I live in Alabama, and the farmers' markets around here don't stay open year-round.

  • Franklin Harris||

    Progress always starts with counter-cultural absolutists removing themselves completely from the mainstream economy, if only as an experiment.



    And then it all comes crashing down after a wild party at Sharon Tate's house.

  • Franklin Harris||

    I've never fully grasped Reason's sneering hatred of farmer's markets, etc.



    Farmers' markets are great. Fresh, locally grown produce and other local food products are great. They are not, however, morally superior, nor are they better for the environment*, nor are they better for the economy.

    * A myth that fails to account for the fact that transportation costs (fuel, pollution) are usually more than made up for by other efficiencies and economies of scale.

  • technomist||

    Well, I would say that traveling from San Francisco to San Diego and back, I don't think I'm being unreasonable in my expectations that I should have seen some.

    I was surprised that even in fairly prosperous places one might expect, like Monterey, there was precious little in the way of genuinely local fresh produce being sold, in the shops, on these well-camoflaged farmers' stalls or at higher end restaurants, where I really would have expected to see such food. I have no doubt you are right, and there could well be some such produce available somewhere, sometimes, but I can only go by my own experience - on the whole I found the food scene in California pretty mediocre. I remarked on returning home to the UK that we had actually spent a lot less on food than I had expected or planned to - mainly because what there was on offer was not really that good. I think the best meals of the trip ended up being Thai, Chinese and Indian restaurants in San Francisco.

  • Mike Laursen||

    That's really weird. The Monterey area is a hotbed of exactly what you were looking for. Next time you are headed out here, let me know and I'll help you find the good stuff.

  • ||

    I always make sure to stock up on locally grown Doritos and energy drinks.

  • R C Dean||

    Like most libertarians, I gots no problem with people buying their food from whoever the fuck they want.

    What sandpapers my ass is the condescending attitude many of the "buy local" types take. Yeah, I'm looking at you, joe. If you don't realize that comments like Real Americans buy what the television tells them aren't smug and condescending, then you really are an elitist ass.

  • R C Dean||

    Progress always starts with counter-cultural absolutists removing themselves completely from the mainstream economy, if only as an experiment.

    What you don't see is how many of these counter-cultural absolutists fizzle away into evolutionary dead ends.

    Being a contrarian isn't of any inherent value. Being a contrarian who is right, that's the trick.

  • ||

    Uh, yeah, which direction are sales of organic foods and locally-produced foods going, again?

    I'm not seeing the fizzling away.

  • ||

    joe, your comment about Americans eating "what television tells them to" is the very definition of "elitist cunt."
    Now kindly go back to looking up "capitalism" and "Franklin Delano Roosevelt" and "Keynes" on wiki.

  • ||

    Elitism and condescention are accusations thrown at anyone who advocates for a minority position.

    What's up with adhering to those wildly-unpopular economic theories of yours, RC? You think you're better'n me?

  • ||

    LOL, wiki.

  • ||

    Jamie Kelly,

    Based on my experience with your mother, I would not call her an elitist.

    And that is all.

  • ||

    Elitism and condescention are accusations thrown at anyone who advocates for a minority position.

    No, they're accusations thrown when you're elitist and condescending.
    I know you like it up there on the cross, but get down now and go back to your corner.

  • ||

    Elitism and condescention are accusations thrown at anyone who advocates for a minority position.

    joe--You're arguing with the voices again. Who here gives a rat's ass where you get your silverqueen corn? Do you honestly (and I use that word loosely) think that advocating farmer's markets and produce stands is a minority position? I know I like going to the local produce stand when I can. The quality is better usually than in the supermarket. It's just not as convenient.

    But yeah, like RC said, the localistas just don't get it. Personally, I like having fresh citrus in the winter.

  • technomist||

    It may be cultural. I did get to try a local cheese: in Monterey there was a place where they put it in a burger, which was quite nice but...

    The restaurants trying more adventurous things did not seem to be using local fresh produce. Maybe the locals are keeping it all to themselves and selling to visitors only what they think the visitors want.

  • ||

    Given the amount of hostility they generate, JW, I'd have to say that supporting local purchasing and farmers' markets is, for some bizarre kultukampf reason, a despised position around here.

  • ||

    Given the amount of hostility they generate, JW, I'd have to say that supporting local purchasing and farmers' markets is, for some bizarre kultukampf reason, a despised position around here.



    joe, would you please go back and read the comments? Jesus Christ. It's not farmer's markets and local purchasing per se, as many of us have told your fat head over and over that we like that choice. It's the elitist buy-local-only Saab-driving Mac-worshiping neo-commie dickheads we don't like, the kind of shitbags who sneer at Wal-Mart shoppers and people who join bowling leagues.
    Maybe you hang around assholes like that so often that you can't smell their shit.
    Do you get it now? Do you?

  • thoreau||

    It's the elitist buy-local-only Saab-driving Mac-worshiping neo-commie dickheads we don't like, the kind of shitbags who sneer at Wal-Mart shoppers and people who join bowling leagues.

    And it's definitely NOT a culture war thing!

  • Mike Laursen||

    Maybe the locals are keeping it all to themselves and selling to visitors only what they think the visitors want.

    You're on to something there. The touristy parts of Monterey are as touristy as touristy gets.

  • ||

    Touche, thoreau, touche.

  • e||

    I'm in yer farmer's market..smugly sneering at yer bowling leagues..

  • ||

    Elitism and condescention...



    LOL, wiki.

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