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What Do Penn State's Joe Paterno and New Republic's Marty Peretz Have In Common Other Than Clearly Being Over the Hill?
Answer: They're starting to shit
themselves in public. JoePa had to sprint off the field during last
saturday's game with Ohio State to avoid a colonic
catastrophe equal to the shellacking the Nittany Lions were
taking on the field. TNR owner and "Spine" blogger Marty Peretz is
enacting the cyberspatial equivalent of Paterno's runs with posts
such as this one on French jokes:
Let me assure you though that I am not a Francophobe. It is true that for a few years in recent times I have not bought French wines. But I did drink the ones I had in my cellar. In any case, there is some silliness in what follows. But there is also some wisdom, wisdom garnered from historical experience. If you are a Francophile, you may not want to read this. It's your choice. Feel free to send this to friends if you like. That's how I saw it in the first place...
"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." --Norman Schwartzkopf
"We can stand here like the French, or we can do something about it." --Marge Simpson
"As far as I'm concerned, war always means failure." --Jacques Chirac, President of France
"As far as France is concerned, you're right." --Rush Limbaugh
"The only time France wants us to go to war is when the German Army is sitting in Paris sipping coffee." --Regis Philbin
More here.
|9.27.06 @ 9:39AM|#
Actually, when JoePa's instestines started giving out on him,
Penn State was winning 3-0.
Go Buckeyes!
|9.27.06 @ 9:41AM|#
Pretty average stuff but the Norman Schwartzkopf one's a
gem.
I laughed. The French are irritating.
|9.27.06 @ 9:51AM|#
Yeah, those French--they said "no" to invading Iraq because there wasn't enough evidence of WMDs and because it would become a quagmire. Boy, were they dumb!
|9.27.06 @ 9:55AM|#
I liked the accordion line. I also love accordions.
Dan T,
I always thought that the American issue with the French was just
inherited baggage from Old Britain. I could be totally wrong,
though.
|9.27.06 @ 9:56AM|#
Of course we hate the French. They are an arrogant, nationalistic democracy. They are too religious, and they think they invented freedom. Jerks.
|9.27.06 @ 9:56AM|#
Yeah, those French--they said "no" to invading Iraq because
there wasn't enough evidence of WMDs and because it would become a
quagmire. Boy, were they dumb!
So did a number of very sensible countries with the exception of
the UK. But even if they had found WMD's and a million nukes
pointed at Paris with the words 'Au revoir mes petits infadels'
scrawled across them, they'd have come up with a reason to not send
any troops (unless they could guarantee no harm befalling any of
them and a steady supply of fresh, doughy baguettes and soft, soft
Robuchon chesse to the front line.)
Anyway - I am obliged by the medium of genetics to dislike the
French. I'm English. I'm sure they would return the
compliment.
|9.27.06 @ 9:58AM|#
It is true that for a few years in recent times I have
not bought French wines.
In Marty's world that bold stand is known as "supporting the
troops". What an ass.
|9.27.06 @ 10:09AM|#
French Jokes, what is this 2002? Seriously, how behind is
Peretz.
"Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys"- Groundskeeper Willie
|9.27.06 @ 10:11AM|#
Actually, over a million Frenchmen died defending Paris,
successfully, from the Germans during WWI.
Spitting on soldiers just comes so easily to
neoconservatives.
Let me know when we get to the part with the wisdom gained from
history.
|9.27.06 @ 10:23AM|#
JoePa really, really needs to retire (like 10 years ago).
That game was a classic Big Televen slugfest until the surprising
Buckeye defense forced Penn State into several key mistakes.
Laurinitis = Baltic Power!
Go Bucks!
O-H...!
|9.27.06 @ 10:24AM|#
Advertising your pre-Iraq War French bashing in 2006 is like driving through Silicon Valley with a "Don't Blame Me, I Voted For Dole" sticker on your car in 1999.
|9.27.06 @ 10:26AM|#
Let me know when we get to the part with the wisdom gained
from history.
Aaahhhh come on Joe. Relax. Poking fun at the french is a
universal, objective fun. It's like laughing at your teenage
brother while he's going through his angsty years and is desperate
to express himself through his poetry.
|9.27.06 @ 10:30AM|#
They also lost over 500,000, military and civilian, defending
Paris in WWII. They didn't just roll over for the Germans, they
were overrun by the same powerful German army that took over most
of Europe.
We, myself included, love to bash the French and they love to bash
us. We are both arrogent nations who think our systems should be
models for the world. I just hope we remember occasionally we are,
ultimately, on the same side. Unless the West is truely dead.
|9.27.06 @ 10:37AM|#
I think most intelligent people understand all that. But it's
just too damn much fun to poke fun at the French. Trust me, they
enjoy poking fun at us just as much.
My theory is that it's like a pair of constantly-fighting siblings.
Coming from basically the same place, with a lot of the same
ideals. The fact that they're so close to one another is exactly
why they appear to hate one another.
It's also just as much fun to poke fun at the very earnest
protestations of joe and co. every time someone dares poke fun at
them.
|9.27.06 @ 10:40AM|#
France deserves some ire for a variety of reasons, but I do
think the whole hurry-up-and-surrender label is mostly undeserved.
Yeah, WWII was a bad deal altogether for France, and the French
government and military looked awful for their substandard
performance (especially given their technological and numerical
superiority over the Germans--something most people don't realize);
however, joe correctly points out that France fought like demons in
WWI.
I'd say the lethargy of WWII likely stemmed in some part from the
price paid in lives and resources in WWI. Coincidentally, I'm about
to pick up William Shirer's The Collapse of
the Third Republic: An Inquiry into the Fall of France in
1940 from the library for some light reading.
Also, to be fair, having Germany as a neighbor can make any country
look bad, militarily speaking. The Franco-Prussian War, WWI, and
WWII all happened within a relatively brief span of years. Poland,
caught between Germany and Russia, looks even more inept.
I consider France to be an annoying older brother who acts like a
bratty younger brother. Still, if France were attacked, I'd
certainly rush to its defense. France is an ally and has been for
most of our history.
On the other hand, our disdain of many things French likely stems
from the infamous taunting episode noted in Arthurian legend.
|9.27.06 @ 10:44AM|#
My favorite French joke isn't a joke at all but a direct quote
from one of the student rioters in the most recent round of
violence:
"They're offering us nothing but slavery," said Maud Pottier, 17, a
student at Jules Verne High School in Sartrouville. "You'll get a
job knowing that you've got to do every single thing they ask you
to do because otherwise you may get sacked."
Wow, a boss who can tell you what to do and maybe even fire you.
That is _exactly_ like slavery.
|9.27.06 @ 10:45AM|#
"Forget France. The French Can Be Annoying. Come to Greece.
We're nicer."
Crazy People.
|9.27.06 @ 10:48AM|#
C'mon, joe, the hatred of France used to unite left and right in
this country, and unite the US with the rest of the world (except
maybe France). That was until 2002, when it became a political
issue.
Oh, for the days when all Americans could make fun of the French
without all of the political baggage that goes along with it.
Scorpio: Which is your least favorite country, Italy or
France?
Homer: France.
Scorpio: Yeah, nobody ever says Italy.
And Nick, thanks for bringing up JoePa, um, "going for two." Like I
need to think about that again.
|9.27.06 @ 10:57AM|#
Spitting on soldiers just comes so easily to
neoconservatives.
Yeah, they must have been watching the lefties welcome back the
troops from Vietnam.
|9.27.06 @ 11:09AM|#
"I think most intelligent people understand all that."
Well, you've just excluded most of the voting public....
D.A. Ridgely|9.27.06 @ 11:10AM|#
Q: How many generations does it take to learn ingratitude?
A: Trois
Okay, having gotten that out of my system, let me go on record that
I have spent some time in France over the years and, even including
while in Paris, the French have been, almost without a single
exception, polite, helpful and hospitable every time.
On the other hand, I could say the same thing about Canadians, and
so,
Q: What do sick Canadians and Americans have in common?
A: Equal access to the world's highest quality health care, in both
cases to be paid for in U.S. dollars.
|9.27.06 @ 11:11AM|#
To paraphrase General Patton'"I rather have two SS Divisions on
my front than to have one French Division in my rear."
During WW2 some Free French forces in North Afica fough with
distinction being mostly people of color and members of the French
Foreign Leagon. But with the exception of some of the efforts of
the French Resistance the avarage Free French Divisions sucked.
They were made up of avarage Frenchmen and were a terrible drain on
the war effort and also managed to commit a disproportionant amount
of the war crimes committed by the western allies.
The French helped the US during our revolution and we should be
greatful for that help. But during the 19th and 20th centuries the
French Military forces have had nothing but failure after
failure.
And despite haveing the technicial and scientific means to build a
formentable military they seem to have some sort of people
problems. Maybe its all that wine they drink.
Tim Cavanaugh|9.27.06 @ 11:15AM|#
They also lost over 500,000, military and civilian,
defending Paris in WWII. They didn't just roll over for the
Germans, they were overrun by the same powerful German army that
took over most of Europe.
The 1940 debacle is a classic example of why losing is the best
preparation for the next war. De Gaulle and his cronies argued for
a mechanized army throughout the thirties but couldn't get anywhere
because of the literally and figuratively entrenched military
establishment. The Germans were starting from scratch and got to
build everything to spec. In his memoirs, which are worth checking
out, de Gaulle emphasizes the few victories France scored in the
disastrous six weeks as examples of what they could have done with
better organization, and says he argued for continuing the war even
if it meant moving out to the colonies. He couldn't get anywhere
with the government or his superiors, all of whom were either in a
panic or as he puts it "playing their own game." It doesn't take
anything away from the sacrifice of the half-million French dead to
say that there was a total failure of leadership.
The problem with jokes about France isn't political or personal.
It's that they're not funny. Nobody thinks or knows enough about
France to give a shit, and the result is comedy that's too vague,
too square, or both; it reminds me of when Bruno Kirby takes over
the radio show in Good Morning, Vietnam, and his A-1
material is "Hey, it's our old pal Frenchie!"
|9.27.06 @ 11:18AM|#
Maybe its all that wine they drink.
Are you kidding? Winemaking is one of their redeeming
qualities.
|9.27.06 @ 11:19AM|#
Any nation that thinks Jerry Lewis is funny can't be............(fill in the blank).........
|9.27.06 @ 11:30AM|#
Yeah, they must have been watching the lefties welcome back
the troops from Vietnam.
That's an urban legend.
|9.27.06 @ 11:33AM|#
Ok. The following story is true. I've already posted it on here
so apologies to anyone that read it before.
About two months ago, it was my three year anniversary with my
better half so I surprised her with a trip to Paris. In the
evening, we decided to revisit a small restaurant off the the Rue
de Rivolis as we had eaten there when we first got together.
So, we were in there and everything was going to plan. I enjoyed my
French Onion soup and was looking forward to my moules frites. To
our left there was a pleasant, middle aged American couple who,
despite cliches to the contrary, were nothing but polite and
considerate. The waiter on the other hand, a genuine parisian in
too tight trousers, was a complete tool. Although moderately polite
to my goodself he was horrible to the Yanks. They did their best to
order in French, laughing nervously, and he shot them down,
tutting, barking at them in French and rolling his eyes. It was
really embarrassing.
So, our food came, we ate it and the Americans were still waiting
on their order. They asked politely twice and euro-weenie brushed
them aside. On the third occasion, by which time they must have
been waiting for nearly an hour, the American gentleman asked
'Excuse me, but where is our food?'
The frenchie sneered down his nose 'I have already told you. It iz
coming.'
The American looked at the waiter, looked at his wife, looked at me
and then back at the waiter. He then said:
'So's Christmas you asshole. Now go cook my steak'
In the words of Mastercard...priceless. My girlfriend almost spat
out her red wine.
As i said at the time - America 1 France 0. Still, the waiter
probably peed in his bernaise sauce.
Scott Lemieux|9.27.06 @ 11:34AM|#
"But even if they had found WMD's and a million nukes pointed at
Paris with the words 'Au revoir mes petits infadels' scrawled
across them, they'd have come up with a reason to not send any
troops (unless they could guarantee no harm befalling any of them
and a steady supply of fresh, doughy baguettes and soft, soft
Robuchon chesse to the front line.)"
If they hadn't sent troops to Afghanistan, this might be something
other than jaw-droppingly idiotic (and funny only to people who
guffaw over chain emails passed on by Marty Peretz, which I suspect
has a high correlation with people who think Tim Allen is the
world's greatest comedian.)
The delusiuon of these people really is amazing; I'm reminded of
nothing so much as Glenn Reynolds saying that a post in which he
mocked people for saying we'd end up in a quagmire "holds up well."
Oh, yeah.
|9.27.06 @ 11:41AM|#
French people are asses. By that I mean that a lot of really cute girls live there and wear thongs really well.
|9.27.06 @ 11:46AM|#
Actually, over a million Frenchmen died defending Paris,
successfully, from the Germans during WWI.
They were also among the first to shoot at us during the invasion
of Africa 24 years later. Vive la Vichy France!
|9.27.06 @ 11:55AM|#
Come on, who here hasn't wanted to sing along to "La Marseillaise" in Casablanca? Heck, I was ready to liberate Paris myself.
|9.27.06 @ 11:57AM|#
So all the solid anti-French data we get out of this thread is a
quote from a lazy high school student, an anecdote about a nasty
waiter, and the observation that the untrained civilians in the
Free French units were poor soldiers.
Bashing the French used to be bipartisan fun. I remember back in
1982 the Village Voice ran a full page of jokes called "100 Reasons
to Hate the French," or something like that. As commenters here
noted, this changed w/ the runup to Iraq. French bashing became the
flipside to the hawks' claim that invasion was necessary and would
be easy. The country found out pretty fast that the hawks were
wrong on both counts. Now French-bashing lingers on as the only
part of the war case that cannot be refuted by facts -- the reason
being that it depends solely on prejudice.
When the hawks bring up the French, they are indulging one more
round of their little game of make-believe in which somehow they
get to be right even though they have been proven wrong. So, yeah,
I am pretty sick of anti-French humor.
I still like the accordion joke. Then again, Schwarzkopf was
against invading.
|9.27.06 @ 12:02PM|#
If they hadn't sent troops to Afghanistan, this might be
something other than jaw-droppingly idiotic
You got me scott. I was just being a knob. Don't really believe
it.
OK people, no more jokes about French people. And while we're at
it, no more gags about British dentisty, German efficiency,
American weight issues, Irish drinking habits, Scottish kilts,
Dutch people saying 'sure', Australian men's obsession with khaki
shorts, anything insulting to the sub continent and definitley no
gags about Italian tanks only driving in reverse.
Also, no more slapstick. Simply not sophisticated enough. We're
looking for elaborate and intelligent humour worked around literary
allusions, textual symbolism and highly ironic, achingly
post-modern commentary.
|9.27.06 @ 12:14PM|#
Mark VIII,
"Poking fun at the french is a universal, objective fun." I agree.
The Simpsons have some great French bashing.
What I object to is people spoiling the fun by trying to cram in
politics and making serious claims.
|9.27.06 @ 12:19PM|#
We're looking for elaborate and intelligent humour worked
around literary allusions, textual symbolism and highly ironic,
achingly post-modern commentary.
Whadya call a boomerang that doesn't come back?
Wait for it....
A stick.
|9.27.06 @ 12:21PM|#
"OK people, no more jokes about French people."
No, no, jokes about French people are great.
Just don't try to bootstrap them into serious commentary about
global issues.
|9.27.06 @ 12:27PM|#
What I object to is people spoiling the fun by trying to
cram in politics and making serious claims.
Totally true. I guess I cot carried away.
|9.27.06 @ 12:45PM|#
I think the French bashing arises out of jealousy. They have the
best food & wine, and they have a beautiful city that runs at a
gloriously relaxed pace.
My experience with the people there was great. They are more
stand-offish than Americans and most other Europeans. Some people
may interpret that as rude. It is not rudeness. They are actually
quite polite. They are perfectionists with language, so, although
most of them do speak English, they are reluctant to do so. We
found that once they realized that we would mangle their language
far worse than they would mangle ours, they would speak relatively
good English with us. The only person we met in Paris that would
not speak English was a waiter who obviously understood English
perfectly, but relished his role as a very demonstrative French
waiter. He was one of the friendliest people we met there.
All the examples of rude "Frenchies" I'll bet could be attributed
to the odd rude person that one can find in any city or countryside
in any country, or could be attributed to a misunderstanding.
Their idea of how an economy should be run is c-a-t dumb, but
that's their problem, not mine. I just want to visit, I don't want
to work or invest there.
|9.27.06 @ 12:49PM|#
The problem with Marty's stupid jokes is that they make the person telling (or laughing at them) look naive and ignorant. Anyone who knows anything about France knows that the French are not cowards. (It is the Italians who don't like to fight). The problem with the French is that they are devious and unreliable, but these jokes all miss that point. The French love a good war if they see a direct benefit to themselves. Who's been stirring up the most trouble in Africa? The French. Who fought longer and harder than any other European power to hold on to their overseas colonies? The French. Who has more active troops under arms than Great Britain? The French. I'm all for ragging on the French - but we should be making fun of them for their arrogance and deviousness, not cowardice. Let's keep our stereotypes straight people.
|9.27.06 @ 12:56PM|#
I think the French bashing arises out of jealousy.
Of course it does. And it's exactly the same as their yank bashing.
Infact, most euro yank bashing is sheer, unadulterated big brother
syndrome. You basically think your big brother's a shit but
somehow, no matter how hard you fight it, end up copying him and
seeking his approval.
They are perfectionists with language
Slight generalisation?
They have the best food & wine
That's one cliche they just llllooovvvveeee. And it's not true.
Give me Spain or Italy any day other French food. And Thailand.
Agreed on the wine though.
|9.27.06 @ 1:01PM|#
Anyone see the WWII era pamphlet that they issued to GI's that was intended to dispute french sterotypes? I think I saw it at the WWII museum in New Orleans. It said things like "the French smell" and then excused it as "they have been occupied for 4 years and they don't have soap" or "the French are lazy" answered with "they are lazy because they are malnourished"
|9.27.06 @ 1:03PM|#
Oh, yeah, Italian is much better. And Spanish, too, for that
matter.
Look, it's all just quibbling among friends and allies. I've got no
problem with the French other than their strange ideas of foreign
policy and economics. Frankly, in those areas, they make us look
good. Just imagine how France would act with our kind of power.
|9.27.06 @ 1:15PM|#
Slight generalisation?
Yes. When speaking of national character, aren't we always going to
be generalising (sic)?
e.g. Americans are more religious than the rest of the
world.
(Damn limeys can't tell when you're supposed to use a "z" or an
"s"!)
Maybe not the best food, but it is waaaaayyyyy
better than British food.
|9.27.06 @ 1:32PM|#
"It is the Italians who don't like to fight" like Julius
Ceasar.
French wine? I like it, I'll still take Italian anyday. Best food?
Not even close. I'll take Indian. Now, best composers? Now we're
talkin'!
Anyway, it's all good fun. I think some people could use a little
of that french wine around here, relax a little. No one likes a
stick in the mud.
|9.27.06 @ 1:34PM|#
Eh. Give me West Coast, Australian, New Zealand, Argentinian or
Chilean wine over French.
Unless you're getting into the $80 range, it's just not very
distinguished.
|9.27.06 @ 1:36PM|#
French food: good, but wildly overrated.
English food: mostly either crap or Indian (good!), but still
underrated.
Can we go back to talking about how JoePa should retire and how the
Buckeyes are kicking ass?
|9.27.06 @ 1:49PM|#
Maybe not the best food, but it is waaaaayyyyy better than
British food.
You don't like chicken tikka masala?
|9.27.06 @ 2:06PM|#
You don't like chicken tikka masala?
The only good meals I have ever had in London were at ethnic
restaurants.
|9.27.06 @ 2:16PM|#
Thanks to the Buckeye who acknowledged that Penn State was ahead
3 - 0 when JoePA had his little episode. Just goes to show that
people (like Nick Gillespie) shouldn't be giving eyewitness
accounts of things they haven't seen.
And to the Buckeyes who smugly pat themselves on the back for
beating Penn State at home, the game is in Happy Valley next year,
and you know who always folds up like an accordion there.
|9.27.06 @ 2:17PM|#
I guess that's what you mean by "French food." Do you mean haute
cuisine? Or do you mean the sort of food you can find at a
traditional bistro? If the latter, then it is some of the best food
in the world.
As to French performances in war, I think negative claims regarding
illustrate the ignorance of a lot of people because they appear to
be making that judgment based on the a very narrow prism that
includes essentially WWII. Even at that they are probably unaware
that the French (as a "multi-racial force") were the best led and
best fighting soldiers in Italy until they were pulled out for the
August 1944 landings in southern France.
Anyway, like any "nation" with such a historical pedigree France
has had its ups and downs in war; as such, this should undermine
any thought that WWII can be used as a proxy for determining the
effectiveness of French arms.
|9.27.06 @ 2:21PM|#
"Just imagine how France would act with our kind of
power."
March all the way to Moscow ? Invade Egypt ?
|9.27.06 @ 2:25PM|#
NI,
Exactly.
Mighty Joe P.L.,
I was worried when you didn't show up to this all French
discussion :)
The biggest problem with France is all of the rich sauces.
|9.27.06 @ 2:29PM|#
BTW, a French movie about the experience of North Africans, etc. in WWII was released this year in France. I believe it has had some limited showings in the U.S. as well. Originally titled Indig�nes, the American title is something like "The Road to Freedom" or "The Road To Glory" or some such.
|9.27.06 @ 2:31PM|#
Phileleutherus Lipsiensis,
Truffles, too. Mustn't forget the truffles. And, really, the best
American cuisine is New Orleans' style, which is a derivative of
French cuisine. Must grant that. Oh, let's remember, they did sell
us half of what's now our country for a song. That was nice.
|9.27.06 @ 2:34PM|#
Pro Libertate,
Napoleon supposedly stated (after the sale) that it would promote a
future where the U.S. would come to "humble" the Royal Navy.
|9.27.06 @ 2:41PM|#
Crepes from the northwest of France (Bretagne) are simply
wonderful.
Indian, Thai, and Italian food are still better.
|9.27.06 @ 2:47PM|#
I seem to recall something about Napoleon predicting that the
U.S. would reach great power status fairly quickly. Guess he didn't
figure on us becoming buddies with the U.K., though. I bet he'd be
even more shocked at how chummy France is with the
U.K.!
I almost forgot another good French thing: Sabine Herold, the
French libertarian.
|9.27.06 @ 2:53PM|#
Timon19,
It is subjective.
Pro Libertate,
Like Bush, we should all be reading Camus. :)
|9.27.06 @ 3:11PM|#
Ah, but CTM is actually English, disguised as
Indian.
Isn't that like saying that chop suey places serve American?
Immigrants came to their new home and created dishes that were
hybrids to suit the ingredients and cooking methods available to
them, or natives took the immigrants' food and tweaked it to appeal
more to the native tastes.
I guess that's what you mean by "French food." Do you mean
haute cuisine? Or do you mean the sort of food you can find at a
traditional bistro? If the latter, then it is some of the best food
in the world.
When I'm talking about French food, I'm talking about our French
hosts serving us homemade pate with homemade fig jam. I'm talking
about a cheese course with dinner every night. I'm talking about
their favorite restaurant offering a pate made from a calf's head -
the whole head. I'm talking about sauces, glorious, rich sauces.
I'm talking about eating lots of duck and always remembering to
save the fat for frying.
|9.27.06 @ 3:18PM|#
I liked the accordion line. I also love
accordions.
Q: What's the difference between an onion and an accordion?
A: Nobody cries when you chop up an accordion.
|9.27.06 @ 3:24PM|#
I think JoePa can keep on coaching. The system they have going can sitll work as long as they get decent recruiting classes, which they have over the past few years. JoePa deserves to coach til he is well physically unable to, not like he calls the plays anymore. But anyway give the Lions another year or two to grow up. It is an awfully young team as last years was fairly senior ladden. Also Pos is not the same as he was last year but Connors and Lee still make PSU linebackers look good.
|9.27.06 @ 3:35PM|#
I just don't really want to see an old man die on national TV. It wasn't all that long ago when a lot of Penn Staters were wishing he had hung up the tinted Coke bottles.
|9.27.06 @ 3:40PM|#
Hey, I resent that joke, Pig Mannix. I like the accordian! I'm not talking Weird Al (or Frankie, for that matter) Yankovic. I'm talking Astor Piazzola. I'm talking tango music.
|9.27.06 @ 3:54PM|#
smacky's into punk polka. Not the new progressive stuff, but the old gritty material. No one can play the polka like those old, Slavic polkamen from the Polish bayou. With their acoustic accordions.
|9.27.06 @ 4:24PM|#
Smacky, ProL,
If you love the accordion, and speaking of French, how 'bout that
there zydeco??
You should see the movie "Schultz gets the Blues", best German
movie I've ever seen.
Yeah Astor Piazzola is great. I like the Slavic stuff myself.
Smacky, you should seriously check out Mostar Sevdah Reunion.
|9.27.06 @ 4:25PM|#
Pro Libertate,
Descartes, Balzac, Fourier, Hugo, Moli�re, Rabelais, Montaigne,
Foucault, Condorcet, Rodin, etc.
|9.27.06 @ 4:40PM|#
Phileleutherus Lipsiensis,
I like my list better, and it had Hugo and Montaigne on it already,
anyhow. I suppose I should throw in Verne, who launched his moon
rocket from "Tampa Town", and Tocqueville, who belongs in any
America-France discussion.
Oh, heck, who was the playwright who wrote Cyrano de
Bergerac? Rostand? Him, too.
|9.27.06 @ 4:52PM|#
kohlrabi,
I have never heard of Mostar Sevdah Reunion. I will have to check
them out. Thanks for the recommendation. I have heard of "Schultz
Gets The Blues". If I remember correctly, it had good reviews, but
I've never seen it myself.
I am not a big fan of zydeco, but some of it is good.
Pro L,
I really don't like punk all that much, actually. :)
You joke, but punk and polka are actually much more closely related
musically than you would think. There is a dj in Cleveland I know
of (a libertarian, actually) whose specialty is polka music and
punk rock.
|9.27.06 @ 5:07PM|#
I'd like to nominate Coco Chanel and Madelaine Vionnet to the list of cool French people. Vionnet invented the bias cut dress, was the first to lift hemlines above the ankle, and more or less eliminated the corset. Chanel was, well, Chanel. Thanks to those two, women got clothing that allowed freedom of movement, which was an essential precursor to political emancipation.
|9.27.06 @ 5:37PM|#
Pro Libertate,
Edmund Rostand.
Of course there is also Rabelais, Beaumarchais, Diderot, Flaubert,
de Laclos, Racine, etc.
|9.27.06 @ 5:42PM|#
Pro Libertate,
Edmund Rostand.
Of course there is also Rabelais, Beaumarchais, Diderot, Flaubert,
de Laclos, Racine, etc.
|9.27.06 @ 6:00PM|#
I have seen a punk-polka band. They were quite fun.
Apparently they have a movie with Li'l Wally,
the World's Polka King.
|9.27.06 @ 7:43PM|#
Got room for one more French joke?
Tough...here it comes...
...it's the one about the new French Army tank; it comes with ten
reverse gears. And one forward gear...just in case the enemy
attacks from behind...
(cue rimshot) Goodnight, Seattle...
|9.27.06 @ 7:43PM|#
But all pales before the awesome fusion of Scottish folk and Cuban salsa: Salsa Celtica.
|9.27.06 @ 8:25PM|#
smacky,
To tell you the truth, it's not that bad. Just using the standard
Cleveland joke about Akron.
|9.27.06 @ 8:42PM|#
The French are one of the few people who understand how to use
their bureaucracies in trade fights with Japan.
Example, some time back: Trade fight over agricultural access to
Japan. (Usual set of excuses trotted out on Japanese side.)
French response: Ok, we'll put up with this. However, we do insist
that all DVD players you import into this country go through
inspection.
...and then proceeded to shunt all the equipment shipped through a
tiny office in Rouen, staffed with 3 people.
Result: instant blocade, totally "legal".
The Japanese quickly caved in.
|9.27.06 @ 8:55PM|#
Punks with squeezeboxes? Brave Combo!
I'm also partial to Joe Burke and Sharon Shannon.
One source of the love-hate relationship between the sister
republics is the competition to be the cultural leader of the
movement away from absolute monarchy to representative government.
The USA was marred for decades by slavery, and later by the
second-class status imposed on non-whites. The French always
thought us hypocrites for that. They, OTOH, backslid into monarchy
and Empire, trading their republican virtue for the idea of a
"civilizing mission" that has always been more welcoming of
centralizing and, to use a froggism, dirigiste
ideas.
Meanwhile the Westminster model was at least as influential at
promoting representative government as the American or French
examples.
I do like Edith Piaf, though.
Kevin
|9.27.06 @ 9:30PM|#
Just using the standard Cleveland joke about
Akron.
I would never.
No, I am really scared of Akron. The only things I ever hear from
Akron are murders, rapes, drug busts and that sort of thing. No
water-skiiing squirrels or loveable pets there for the news to
report on, I guess.
|9.27.06 @ 10:00PM|#
Heaven:
All the chefs are french, all the engineers are german, all the
police are english, all the lovers are italian and it's all
organized by the swiss.
Hell:
All the chefs are english, all the engineers are french, all the
police are german, all the lovers are swiss and it's all organized
by the italians.
|9.27.06 @ 10:01PM|#
It's ok with me if you make fun of Cleveland, Timon19. I can't help the fact that I was hatched here. -_-
|9.28.06 @ 2:22AM|#
Akron
gave us the Waitresses, Tin Huey, Rachel Sweet and, of course, Devo
so it can't be all bad!
Kevin
|9.28.06 @ 9:35AM|#
I've been informed by someone who should know that all of the real trouble comes from Youngstown.
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