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Heavy Metal Palin Lot
Get-a-camera-and-talk-to-freaks can be the lowest form of journalism. Do the people who show up at McCain rallies hate Obama more than your average schlub? Of course. Will they say silly things if you ask the right questions? Sure.
Still, this video by an Ohio liberal blogger is
bloodcurdling.
Via Jonathan
Martin, who says "it's difficult to imagine even the most
hard-core conservatives saying that Al Gore or John Kerry were
terrorists." This is a huge problem with the McCain campaign's
negative turn. No swing voter took offense if a Bush surrogate
called Kerry a limp-wristed, French-looking fraud. But I think they
wince when they hear someone accusing Obama of terrorist
"bloodlines." The guy still has a net 18-point favorable rating.
People simply don't look at him and think "radical." The velocity
with which the McCain campaign has become a political arm of
Sean Hannity's America makes it look ugly and desperate,
rather than strong, as Bush I looked when he mocked Dukakis or Bush
II looked when he mocked Kerry.
UPDATE: Oh, God.
This is the blowback when McCain/Palin go hard negative. They rev
up the base, but what on-the-fence voter wants to associate with
people like this? It reminds me of the collapse of the illegal
immigration issue. Yes, a majority of people told pollsters they
wanted "secure borders," but once they started associating those
opinions with beer-bellied Minutemen snooping around the AZ-Mexico
border, or mouthbreathing radio hosts like Michael
Savage...
BDB|10.9.08 @ 9:52AM|#
If McCain and Palin don't reign in their rallies and tone down the rhetoric the only people left voting for them on election day will be cranks, conspiracy theorists, racists, Freepers, and Lou Dobbs.
|10.9.08 @ 9:53AM|#
His career was launched by a terrorist. Close enough. Also, he doesn't look like the other presidents on our money. And he has a funny name.
Abdul|10.9.08 @ 9:56AM|#
It is hard to imagine that the rhetoric has gotten so heated. As bad as Bush was, no mainstream liberals have ever resorted to hyberbole by suggesting that he was a terrorist, or Hitler, or that he intercepted the mail from their kids in summer camp.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 9:57AM|#
Abdul--
Did anyone every shout at an official Gore or Kerry rally "OFF WITH
HIS HEAD"!,
"TREASON!", or "KILL HIM!"?
Dave Weigel|10.9.08 @ 9:57AM|#
His career was launched by a terrorist.
That reminds me - I almost think McCain would be better off letting
Ayers percolate in e-mails than keep explaining who he is. The more
you know, the less threatening it sounds.
"Obama served on a board with a TERRORIST!"
"Oh my God! A member of al Qaeda?"
"Uh... no. A white trust fund kid who protested the Vietnam
War."
gmatts|10.9.08 @ 9:58AM|#
I'm surprised that McCain didn't choose the blond-haired woman
than kept popping up in the video to be his VP.
"Don't answer his questions unless they are in writing"
What the hell is the significance of them being in writing?
|10.9.08 @ 9:58AM|#
I don't think the fascist hysterial element of these tapes
really needs much elaboration.
I think this is a good point: No swing voter took offense if a
Bush surrogate called Kerry a limp-wristed, French-looking fraud.
But I think they wince when they hear someone accusing Obama of
terrorist "bloodlines." The guy still has a net 18-point favorable
rating. People simply don't look at him and think "radical."
There are a lot of people, even McCain voters, who like or at least
respect Barack Obama. There are a lot of them who actually
considered voting for Obama, but ultimately came down on the side
of McCain. This is especially true of people who are now McCain
leaners.
Those people don't want to hear this crap. It's an insult to them,
not just to Obama.
|10.9.08 @ 9:59AM|#
Wow, this is a surprise--there are a lot of angry, scared,
ignorant white people who hate Barack Obama.
HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN IN AMERICA?!?!?
|10.9.08 @ 10:02AM|#
If this video gets widespread distribution, people will make a
point of voting Obama just to feel like they're sticking it to the
troglodytes saying those things.
But Dana Milbank totally made up that "Sit down, boy!" story,
because that would never really happen at a Palin rally.
Bingo|10.9.08 @ 10:03AM|#
I don't even care anymore, hardcore Dems and Repubs are loud,
angry, and delusional.
Maybe in 4 years there will be a change, but I doubt it. Either
way, we are fucked.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:03AM|#
Joe--
That is if McCain doesn't come out and make a statement about this
stuff (Palin, too).
|10.9.08 @ 10:04AM|#
These folks are just cranks, no more, no less. McCain is no more
responsible for them than Obama is for Sarah Bernhard and her
comments. Are you really insulted by this sort of thing? My
reaction is a cross between amusement and pity.
The more wacky and eccentric the comment, the less believed it is.
I give the voters who see this sort of stuff a lot more credit for
knowing it is silliness than you do, apparently.
|10.9.08 @ 10:05AM|#
Remember all of those Freeper posts and H&R threat comments about Barack Obama speeches being like Nazi rallies because there were, like, lotsa people there?
Abdul|10.9.08 @ 10:07AM|#
BDB,
All I'm saying is that there is irrational anger on both the left
and the right. Apparently, sarah
palin's very existence drives them to ruin their own
lives!
The left tolerated photoshops of McCain as a cannibaltolerated
photoshops of McCain as a cannibal, and now they
complain?
As Weigel said, you can take a camcorder to any rally in this
country and get people to say stupid, angry stuff. To blame it all
on the candidates is to take away any sense of personal
responsibility or accountability.
|10.9.08 @ 10:09AM|#
Will I ever get the IQ points back that just fell away with
those clips?
BDB, LMAO, Palin is leading the charges here. Cindy McCain has
accused the Obama campaign of being the dirtiest in history. McCain
just hopes to Hannity it all works.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:12AM|#
Brotherben, he's going to lose like Goldwater or possibly even
McGovern if Palin keeps it up.
Do you really think they'll keep doing it next week if they're
sinking in the polls?
It's at the point where Georgia is closer to being a swing state
than Pennsylvania already.
bubba|10.9.08 @ 10:12AM|#
Are you saying that the Dems finally nominated someone so left
wing that no one believes it?
Obama's past is so inflamatory that it makes McCain look bad for
saying such outrageous things?
That's actually a brilliant strategy.
|10.9.08 @ 10:12AM|#
Will I ever get the IQ points back that just fell away with
those clips?
No. They are now the legal property of GoogleTube. They are
currently being used to index videos of drunk teenagers drawing on
each other with permanent markers and cell-phone footage of a bum
taking a shit in Washington Square Park.
|10.9.08 @ 10:17AM|#
The worst things Abdul to link to don't begin to add up to that
one woman talking about Obama's bloodlines.
Ohnoes, a photoshop! And people don't like Sarah Palin!
|10.9.08 @ 10:17AM|#
Well, thanks, assholes, for describing the videos, but I guess I
can gather enough from your comments to grok what's going on.
I'd like to hear some judgments, though: what's creepier, the
children singing for the Obamessiah, or these kooks?
|10.9.08 @ 10:18AM|#
The more you know, the less threatening it
sounds.
Pretty much the same story as Brack's BLT church. The clips were
somewhat alarming at first, but then you realize that kind of
rambling epileptic stupidity is just par for the course in the
environment Barack choose to launch himself from. Sometimes you
have to wade through the muck before you can rise above it.
Pablo|10.9.08 @ 10:18AM|#
When that redneck woman said she wanted Hillary Clinton as president, I was baffled at first; how can someone have such far-right views and still vote for Hillary? I guess I watch too much cable news, listen to too much talk radio, and go to too many blogs.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:18AM|#
I don't think we have to worry about the children signing about Obama turning into Timothy McVeigh.
Joel|10.9.08 @ 10:18AM|#
If the Obama types can spread these videos wide enough, (as, I
note, Reason is helping them to do) McCain is toast. This time next
year he'll be growing a beard and going on about global warming.
Gad, what free publicity.
We're screwed either way, president-wise. But...
Oh, brave new world that has such - appalling - people in it.
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 10:22AM|#
Abdul,
I think you would have a better point if McCain/Palin wasn't
deliberately inciting. In that case, it would just be a case of
wingnutitis. Every party has its crazies, after all.
But McCain/Palin is *inviting the crazies to come out and play*.
So, they bear some responsibility for intentionally exploiting the
baser nature of some of the pre-existing silliness towards their
opponents.
This is on a different level than calling McCain a cannibal (or a
Cylon, for that matter), because those are fundamentally
unbelievable claims, even to a person who knows next to nothing
about McCain.
|10.9.08 @ 10:22AM|#
Epi, sorry.
First vid shows folks at a rally. camera guy asks if Obama is a
terrorist. answers include, "well, he's got the bloodlines." one
woman claims she knows Palin better than Obama because Palin has
done more interviews.
Second vid is of some ole uber redneck drunk chick sayin stuff
like, "We're fightin Ay-rabs in Iraq and Iran, why would we want an
Ay-rab for president?"
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 10:24AM|#
When that redneck woman said she wanted Hillary Clinton as
president, I was baffled at first; how can someone have such
far-right views and still vote for Hillary? I guess I watch too
much cable news, listen to too much talk radio, and go to too many
blogs.
Hateful ignorance is certainly not the exclusive property of the
right. They are just usually better at exploiting it come election
time.
|10.9.08 @ 10:25AM|#
Episiarch,
"Do you think he's a terrorist?"
"Yes."
"Do you think he's a terrorist?"
"Well, he's got the bloodlines."
"Do you think he's a terrorist?"
"Well, look at his name. Obama. Obama. Hussein. Obama."
ktc2|10.9.08 @ 10:26AM|#
LOL. Like I said months ago when this is all over McCain will be doing the spokesman thing (think Bob Dole and Viagra) for Depends.
|10.9.08 @ 10:27AM|#
jayjayhawker,
actually, in a follow up story, it was revealed that the banjo
player was banished from town for excessive culture.
|10.9.08 @ 10:28AM|#
I think there's cause for concern at this behavior and the tacit
acceptance of it by McCain and Palin. When someone yelled that
Democrats were terrorists at a Giuliani rally. He stopped and told
people to chill out and that while the party's ideas are different,
at the end of the day we're all Americans. McCain and Palin are
only feeding into the angry craziness.
Apparently, it's also serious enough that the Secret Service is
checking it out.
|10.9.08 @ 10:30AM|#
OK, thanks, brotherben and joe. Man, I wish I could watch. Kooks sure are entertaining, aren't they?
cunnivore|10.9.08 @ 10:32AM|#
I'll note that this is all taking place in a northern state
(Ohio).
Not surprising. No offense to Ruthless/Gallaher, but southern Ohio
is more southern than the South. Didn't the KKK originate in
Chillicothe?
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 10:34AM|#
I'll note that this is all taking place in a northern state
(Ohio).
Hateful ignorance is no respecter of latitude.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 10:38AM|#
"Obama served on a board with a TERRORIST!"
Good point (not being sarcastic). The problem with this line of
attack is that it's very easy to say that this board and foundation
included a bunch of people, including members of Nixon's
administration, bank CEOs, and an Ambassador under Bush 41. Real
radicals.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:41AM|#
That, and McCain looks like a pussy for not bringing it up in
the debates.
Bush Sr. had the stones to call Bill Clinton a Communist
sympathizer to his face at least.
Chloe|10.9.08 @ 10:41AM|#
There are freaks on both sides. Anyone who denies it is just a liar and a hack. I've heard a lot of bloodcurdling things from the Obama worshipers too.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 10:41AM|#
OK, thanks, brotherben and joe. Man, I wish I could watch.
Kooks sure are entertaining, aren't they?
They really didn't seem that kooky to me, which actually makes it a
little scarier. If they were raving lunatics, you could write them
off, but most of the people just seemed like run of the mill
suburbanites.
The second video is a whole 'nother ball of wax. It's Appalachian
folks who sound like they have maybe a sixth grade education. I've
never visited that part of the country, but they're the
stereotypical hillbillies. I don't have a problem with them,
because I get the feeling they shouldn't necessarily know
better.
|10.9.08 @ 10:42AM|#
When you choose your running mate based on who will "rally the base" you can't be surprised when that base says crazy things on camera. That said, this looks like some liberal blogger went to a Palin rally looking for a fight, then says gotcha when he didn't get reasoned political discourse in return.
|10.9.08 @ 10:42AM|#
I'll note that this is all taking place in a northern state
(Ohio).
The Appalacian part of Ohio (the SE) was one of the last Klan
strongholds in the country.
It's also where John Kerry sent John Edwards to do retain
campaigning. "Gosh, ya'll talk kinda lahk me!"
Abdul|10.9.08 @ 10:42AM|#
Joe,
It seems you're suggesting that the "bloodlines" person is worse
then anything on the left because the comment(like Epi, I can't
wtfv either) is racist.
I'll grant that it's a racist attack. Of course Obama nutters can't
match the racism of McCain nutters because black-on-white racism
just doesn't have the same sting as white-on-black racism. But the
I-hope-palin-is-gang-raped stuff is just as ugly.
There's lots of other examples of ugliness too. The bush=hitler
crowd, the 9-11 truthers, etc. You really aren't suggesting that
the worst ugliness belongs to one party, are you?
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:43AM|#
Someone please find a video of an O-bot shouting KILL HIM!
referring to McCain at an official Obama/Biden rally, or shouting
OFF WITH HIS HEAD!
Thanks.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 10:44AM|#
I've heard a lot of bloodcurdling things from the Obama
worshipers too.
I won't deny that there are plenty of nutjobs on both sides, but I
haven't yet heard an Obama supporter yell "Kill him" in a public
forum. On McCain, the worst I've heard are the people who call him
a traitor, and that's
from other POWs.
|10.9.08 @ 10:45AM|#
There are crazies all over, Abdul.
That's why decent candidates don't cross certain lines. That's the
point.
Warty|10.9.08 @ 10:46AM|#
Magnificent headline, David.
Didn't the KKK originate in Chillicothe?
No. Why would you believe something so stupid?
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 10:46AM|#
They remind me of the crazies at Barack Obama's
church.
He went to the church where they bring people up to protect them
from witchcraft, and where they try to "cure" gay people,
right?
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 10:46AM|#
That said, this looks like some liberal blogger went to a
Palin rally looking for a fight, then says gotcha when he didn't
get reasoned political discourse in return.
Unless that first video was wackily edited and re-dubbed, you can't
write this one off on "trolling libr'l bloggers". He was asking
simple factual questions, and these scarily normal-looking
suburbanites took the bait.
"Is Obama a Terrorist?"
How fucked up in the head do you have to be to call a sitting US
Senator, with no history of violence nor *real* associations with
any terrorist organizations nor any sympathy with any terrorist
philosophy, a terrorist?
Abdul|10.9.08 @ 10:47AM|#
BDB,
I think one of the interesting points you're implicitly raising is
that the ugly animus from the Obama side is rarely directed at
McCain personally. For whatever reason, the equivalent stuff from
the left is directed at Palin.
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 10:47AM|#
No. Why would you believe something so stupid?
Wasn't it in Tennessee? Something about how since Tennessee never
was occupied under reconstruction, shenanigans could and did take
place?
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:48AM|#
Abdul, did you ever hear an O-bot scream RAPE HER! at an Obama/Biden rally? Or "OFF WITH HER HEAD"?
|10.9.08 @ 10:48AM|#
Do people yell "kill her!" and "terrorist" at Sarah Palin?
Do the Democratic candidates stand there and smile while they
do?
|10.9.08 @ 10:50AM|#
Them folks is crazy. Oh the other hand, so are all the "Bush is a terrorist" folks. Bush IS a terrorist responses coming in 3...2...1...
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:52AM|#
How hard is it for people here to understand the difference between something shouted at an ASNWER (or, say, a Minuteman) rally and one officially condoned by the party nominee?
Abdul|10.9.08 @ 10:52AM|#
BDB & joe,
Yes. In fact, I heard Michelle Obama yell it. Then they all
decapitated a kitten.
Now what? Have I proved the left is morally more unsound thean the
right?
|10.9.08 @ 10:53AM|#
"Unless that first video was wackily edited and re-dubbed,
you can't write this one off on 'trolling libr'l bloggers'. He was
asking simple factual questions, and these scarily normal-looking
suburbanites took the bait."
I dunno, whenever a cameraman from the opposing side (not
officially, but its obvious) there's no "simple factual questions".
Try this: next time your wife or girlfriend goes to the ladies
room, follow her in with a video camera and ask who's going to be
munching on carpet tonight.
JMR|10.9.08 @ 10:53AM|#
I know! Let's blame McCain's nutcases on Ron Paul!! It MUST be that goddamn libertarian's fault, and we all know from Paul's campaign that the most extreme nutcase fully-represents a campaign!!!
|10.9.08 @ 10:55AM|#
Oh, please. There are dopes on all sides.
They say worse stuff at Obama's church.
Let's not forget the the whole "George Bush is the real terrorist"
BS from every anti-war rally and Bush =Hitler; the Atlantic cover
photog; Randi Rhodes advocating Bush's assasination on the air(but
she still has a job!).
|10.9.08 @ 10:55AM|#
Abdul,
Have I proved the left is morally more unsound thean the
right?
No, because, as opposed to those videos, and the news reports we've
been seeing about McCain/Palin rallies for the past few days, your
little story is fictional.
|10.9.08 @ 10:57AM|#
Let's not forget the the whole "George Bush is the real
terrorist" BS from every anti-war rally and Bush =Hitler; the
Atlantic cover photog; Randi Rhodes advocating Bush's assasination
on the air(but she still has a job!).
Well then, I'm sure we'll be seeing the footage of people yelling
"terrorist" and "kill him" at Barack Obama/Joe Biden rallies.
Any minute now. Yup, any minute now. Because, well, you too!
BDB|10.9.08 @ 10:58AM|#
I'm going to say it real simple so everyone can
understand.
Official candidate rally != ANSWER/Minuteman/La Raza/Freeper
rally
|10.9.08 @ 11:02AM|#
This reminds me of the should be medicated folks that came out of the woodwork to support the Ron Paul run. I'm certain I could get some real wacky, even scary, disgusting quotes at an Obama rally. I bet it would be harder though.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 11:02AM|#
Them folks is crazy. Oh the other hand, so are all the "Bush
is a terrorist" folks. Bush IS a terrorist responses coming in
3...2...1...
Alright, I'll bite. Let me preface this by saying I DO NOT BELIEVE
GEORGE W. BUSH IS A TERRORIST.
However, the people usually accusing him of such are basing that
accusation on the conduct of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. They
don't think he's planning suicide bombings or building IEDs or
arming car bombs. Nor do they think he's running an Al Qaida like
cell.
I get the impression that most of these people, if asked, would say
of Obama "well no, he's not technically a terrorist" based on the
same set of facts and conditions. But I think there's a large
number of them who probably believe that Obama is secretly
connected to terrorist organizations. Because he's, ya know, a
Muslim, and all Muslims are terrorists, right? I mean "Obama"?
"Hussein"? Really?
PR|10.9.08 @ 11:02AM|#
i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention screaming kill her at malkin.
|10.9.08 @ 11:02AM|#
I love it when the dems try to act like only certain types of
crazy matter and some are negated. (As in the ones that apply to
the Obama crowd aren't really that bad.)
I also love it when the government interference lovers in this
forum are exposed. What a bunch of posers.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:03AM|#
"i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention screaming kill
her at malkin."
Then I'm sure you can find it and post the link.
|10.9.08 @ 11:04AM|#
Hey guys, please spend 200 more posts trying to pin the "your crazies are crazier than our crazies" label on each other. It entertains me immensely.
|10.9.08 @ 11:05AM|#
I think it is times like this when Reason's comsotarian bias
really shines through the most. If McCain loses this election, it
isn't going to be because he smeared Obama too much. It's going to
be because as of today, he's barely bothered trying to smear him at
all.
The issues are a wash. Neither guy has the slightest clue what's
going on and the differences between them on the issues are small
enough to fit on a pin head. But the economy is bad and people
associate McCain with Bush, so McCain is toast unless he turns this
thing in to a race about Obama. As a candidate, Obama is terribly
flawed. He's a member of a despised race. I know that cosmos strain
themselves to think otherwise, but when the average American thinks
of a black person they think of the guy who tried to mug them, or
the pan handler they pass every day, or the vile, utterly
uncontrollable kids congregating around the bus stop. Blacking
Obama up is the best thing McCain can do. And it would be a hell of
a lot more effective than these intellectually based smears about
William Ayers. If the smear requires a detailed knowledge of
history, it isn't an effective smear.
|10.9.08 @ 11:07AM|#
PR, in the time it took to post at 11:05, you could have done
this:
http://www.peoplespresscollective.org/2008/08/exclusive-michelle-malkin-attacked-dnc/
|10.9.08 @ 11:08AM|#
BDB,
Heir
I can't watch the video, so I will not verify it contains what it
purports to contain.
|10.9.08 @ 11:09AM|#
but when the average American thinks of a black person they
think of the guy who tried to mug them, or the pan handler they
pass every day, or the vile, utterly uncontrollable kids
congregating around the bus stop
You have a low opinion of Americans.
This is not the country you think it is.
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 11:09AM|#
I dunno, whenever a cameraman from the opposing side (not
officially, but its obvious) there's no "simple factual questions".
Try this: next time your wife or girlfriend goes to the ladies
room, follow her in with a video camera and ask who's going to be
munching on carpet tonight.
You could always not answer the question. Or reject the premise of
the question. They did neither.
Bush IS a terrorist responses coming in 3...2...1...
terrorist != war criminal
Duh.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:09AM|#
That wasn't at the DNC. That was at a leftist protest outside the DNC. Something tells me people protesting the DNC probably aren't Democrats. Especially since they guy is calling Democrats "fake liberal neocons".
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:11AM|#
Jeeze, I at least expected it to take place INSIDE the hall, of not done by actual delegates. Nice try, though.
|10.9.08 @ 11:14AM|#
(Now having watched it.) There is a guy chanting "Kill Michelle
Malkin" over and over again. Not at the DNC. And definitely not a
neo-con plant. But he is a Truther.
Not that I care. Pox, houses, that sort of thing.
PR|10.9.08 @ 11:14AM|#
yeah you nailed me. i lied. it wasn't at the dnc. it was only near the dnc and it wasn't superdelegates leading the charge.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:15AM|#
Hey PR, I bet I could find video of Fred Phelps screaming GOD HATES FAGS outside the RNC.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 11:15AM|#
i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention screaming
kill her at malkin.
I don't want her killed. I think it would good for her to spend
some time in an internment camp, though.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:16AM|#
And sure enough!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDDvIOCCMOg
OMG FRED PHELPS AT THE RNC!!!
|10.9.08 @ 11:16AM|#
"You could always not answer the question. Or reject the
premise of the question. They did neither."
Yeah, like I said, some blogger got a bunch of idiots to advertise
their stupidity on camera. It's a low class, cheap shot regardless
of whether the left or right does it. If you confront 100 people
under those circumstances, a certain number will respond with
idiocy. I don't need to see the dregs of our political discourse
splashed on my screen, and I think people who draw some sort of
message from it are at the same level as the stupidity spewers, but
they can sit back and proclaim their superiority because they
aren't on video, as if video makes stupidity more stupid and not
just more visible.
|10.9.08 @ 11:29AM|#
SugarFree | October 9, 2008, 11:14am | #
(Now having watched it.) There is a guy chanting "Kill Michelle
Malkin" over and over again. Not at the DNC. And definitely not a
neo-con plant. But he is a Truther.
Not that I care. Pox, houses, that sort of thing.
Truer words have never been written. A pox on people who oppose the
Democrats from the right, and a pox on people who protest the
Democrats from the left.
;-P
I don't want her killed. I think it would good for her to spend
some time in an internment camp, though.
Oh, Seitz, I think you should put a little more imagination into
the question. It's...worthwhile.
Lamar,
Sure, it's Gotcha, but you know what? They got 'em. And those
people aren't just saying stupid stuff - they're combining their
stupid stuff with the words and ideas that are being said by the
McCain campaign itself.
Hmmm...|10.9.08 @ 11:33AM|#
MCcain, MCveigh....are they brothers???
It's in those Scots-Irish bloodlines...
|10.9.08 @ 11:37AM|#
"Lamar, Sure, it's Gotcha, but you know what? They got 'em.
And those people aren't just saying stupid stuff - they're
combining their stupid stuff with the words and ideas that are
being said by the McCain campaign itself."
Yeah, I know, and I can't disagree. But Elemenope had such a big
heart in the renter foreclosure thread, and now its all "hang 'em
high" on embarrassing the idiots of America. Yeah, I know, totally
different. Somewhere in the bizarro world, Chris Crocker is
screaming, "leave them alone!"
Nick|10.9.08 @ 11:39AM|#
What I want to know more about is whether Obama was a member of the "New Party" back in the mid-90s. The party described itself as "socialist democratic," and I would be interested as to whether this becomes an October surprise. All McCain has to do is prove that Obama is a socialist (and really, it's getting harder to deny), and I think he's got a good chance at making enough Americans uncomfortable with Obama to win the election. I agree that using guilt by association is a bad electoral tactic (after all, I'm sure McCain has met and worked with some pretty bad people over the course of his career, too) but if Obama voluntarily joined an organization that describes itself as "socialist," that's a completely different story.
dhex|10.9.08 @ 11:41AM|#
let me help jeff out:
"Is Obama a Terrorist?"
the correct answer is that they're both running for
terrorist-in-chief. hence the promises of candy canes and sunshine
for everyone; it helps the terror go down better.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 11:41AM|#
Nick--
Illinois, IIRC, has a fusionist system like New York so it's
possible that when you run for state Senate you would be endorsed
by more than one party (think of the Liberals, Conservatives,
Right-to-Life, Working Families) in New york.
|10.9.08 @ 11:44AM|#
Is it just me, or did that blond woman in the first video have
two pupils as black as two piss-holes in the snow? Maybe it was
just the video quality, but she sure looked like she was halfway
through an acid trip. Maybe Obama will seem less demonic to her
when she comes down, but I guess I can give her a pass because the
things around her probably looked a lot like "Fantasia" at the
time.
As for the content in general, I can't say I'm surprised that the
interviewer found a bunch of kooks in the parking lot of a
political rally, but those crankhead bikers in the second video
were pure comedy gold.
|10.9.08 @ 11:48AM|#
Why is Dave all "Oh, God" about the second video. Looks like one
drunk woman ranting about ay-rabs with several of her dude friends,
on and off camera, winding her up but good. In fact, they seem to
be poking fun at her. One of the dudes even looks embarrassed &
tries to get her to shut up. I'm inclined to file under not so
scary.
The first video on the other hand ...
|10.9.08 @ 11:49AM|#
"but if Obama voluntarily joined an organization that
describes itself as "socialist," that's a completely different
story."
Nuh-uh, Nick! He didn't join it! He was just in the car with
someone who was going to a party meeting and just happened to be
standing there and signing his name to a list when the person with
a car was joining the party. He didn't know it was a socialist
party list that he was signing. He thought he was signing up for a
country club.
LGF Fan|10.9.08 @ 11:50AM|#
Fusionist inside baseball Illinois politics will win this election for us! OCTOBER SURPRISE!
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 11:50AM|#
MCcain, MCveigh....are they brothers???
It's in those Scots-Irish bloodlines...
My thing is, McCain literally means "Son of Cain". And I'm fucking
shocked this hasn't been a more common title-smear, in this
religiously gripped society.
|10.9.08 @ 11:50AM|#
BDB | October 9, 2008, 11:03am | #
"i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention screaming kill her at malkin."
Then I'm sure you can find it and post the link.
PR | October 9, 2008, 11:05am | #
find it yourself. it exists.
Way to bump up your credibilty, PR. Not even a IIRC/can't find the
%^* link disclaimer.
Zeb|10.9.08 @ 11:51AM|#
Calling Bush a terrorist is at worst ridiculous hyperbole.
Calling Obama a terrorist is incredibly ignorant racist
garbage.
I really get tired of hearing "the left does this" and "the right
does that". There is no such thing as "the left" or "the right".
Individuals can often be identified as left or right politically,
but they don't all get together and decide what crazy bullshit they
are going to spout this month.
Rick H.|10.9.08 @ 11:53AM|#
The hillbillies in the second video don't bug me at all, because
they are 1) obviously shitfaced and 2) not at a political rally.
The first video presents a parade of activists who are apparently
morons when they're sober.
I'll note that this is all taking place in a northern state
(Ohio).
The second video is from SE Kentucky.
LarryA|10.9.08 @ 11:55AM|#
Get-a-camera-and-talk-to-freaks can be the lowest form of
journalism.
Not even close. I'd nominate shoving a microphone into the face of
a mother that has just lost a child.
Hateful ignorance is certainly not the exclusive property of
the right. They are just usually better at exploiting it come
election time.
You don't think that maybe when MSM journalists cover an
Obama/Biden rally they get footage like this, but it ends up on the
cutting room floor?
There are bigots on both sides. What kind of Palen comments would
you expect at a PETA rally?
|10.9.08 @ 11:55AM|#
but they don't all get together and decide what crazy
bullshit they are going to spout this month
You obviously ignored the B. HUSSEIN Obama and "why talk about
Edwards at all" memes.
Coordinated action doesn't require central planning, just committed
people attuned to the correct signals.
Uncle Bob|10.9.08 @ 11:57AM|#
"I'll note that this is all taking place in a northern state
(Ohio)."
It had to be a bus load of southerners that came up north just to
stir up trouble. Ought to mind their own business, otherwise
they'll find themselves buried in the Ohio swamp somewhere. Let the
people of Ohio just be, instead of forcing them southern views on
everyone else.
TallDave|10.9.08 @ 11:58AM|#
Via Jonathan Martin, who says "it's difficult to imagine
even the most hard-core conservatives saying that Al Gore or John
Kerry were terrorists."
POssibly because those two candidates didn't have close
associations with... terrorists.
The major difference is the ignorance on the right doesn't get made
into front-pagers on the NYT.
|10.9.08 @ 12:05PM|#
A PETA rally?
So the reasoning here is that the McCain/Palin campaign is roughly
equivalent to PETA, in terms of their radicalism?
That is an extraordinary statement.
|10.9.08 @ 12:07PM|#
The woman in the 2nd video can't be all that hillbilly. She
still has most of her teeth.
She must be a DNC plant!
|10.9.08 @ 12:07PM|#
POssibly because those two candidates didn't have close
associations with... terrorists.
Oh, c'mon, TallDave. Ayers and Dohrn are just a couple in his
neighborhood.
Who hosted his Senate campaign kick-off.
And served with him on a few foundation boards, distributing money
to left-wing causes.
And have known him since before he moved to Chicago.
And helped him get his job as chair of those foundation boards.
|10.9.08 @ 12:07PM|#
So the reasoning here is that the McCain/Palin campaign is
roughly equivalent to PETA, in terms of their
radicalism?
I won't eat any Republican that has a face.
PR|10.9.08 @ 12:08PM|#
uh talldave? it's supposed to be:
POssibly because those two candidates didn't have close
associations with... terrorists a white trust fund kid
who protested the Vietnam War.
|10.9.08 @ 12:10PM|#
"Uh... no. A white trust fund kid who protested the Vietnam
War."
Obama is clearly NOT a terrorist, but Ayers clearly was. You can't
possibly be serious, can you?
BDB|10.9.08 @ 12:16PM|#
"So, how long do you think the old man is going to talk about
the Sixties?"
Until he sees over the weekend that his poll numbers have plummeted
even further.
RCP Average in PA: O +13.8
I'm giving him until that reaches + 20.
$|10.9.08 @ 12:17PM|#
You can't possibly be serious, can you?
It doesn't count when white people do it. Unless they're poor. Then
they're not really white.
|10.9.08 @ 12:19PM|#
So, how long do you think the old man is going to talk about
the Sixties?
'Til those damn hippies get off the TV with their girly hair and
marijuana injections!
|10.9.08 @ 12:20PM|#
Ignorant rednecks are ignorant rednecks. Whaddyagonna do?
What really gets me is when people in a position to know what's
going on keep giving this crap credibility. They can see what's
going as clearly as anyone, but they just. Don't. Care. At least,
not as much as they care about the Republicans winning an
election.
|10.9.08 @ 12:27PM|#
I am gonna quote Biden's answer, when asked about some of this. This is a paraphrase, "when some of these really ugly things are yelled out, if the candidate hears it, I think it is their responsibility to say "woe woe woe now. Thats just wrong'."
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 12:27PM|#
All terrorists are not equal.
[White trust-fund kid who makes a pipe-bomb] != [tightly knit
network of guys with plans to fly planes into skyscrapers]
It occurs to me that I've had to use the "!=" a real fucking lot
lately. It's almost like there is a meme conflation disease
propagating through the site.
QSL|10.9.08 @ 12:29PM|#
The clips were telling. I think the blogger did a good job (in
the first clip) exposing some of these people's beliefs in some
Obama-terrorist connection.
The only question meant to be a "Gotcha" that doesn't impress me is
the whole bit about 'only knowing Sarah Palin for 1 month, so why
would you support her' angle.
If a candidate came along and represented my views - from the
economy to social matters to foreign policy - would it matter if
that person's name entered my psyche one month ago or five years
ago? I can read up on that person's viewpoints, background and
voting record by doing a day's worth of Internet searches.
|10.9.08 @ 12:32PM|#
QSL, I am guessing that was a response to the McCain campaign saying we should ask ourselves just how well we know Obama.
|10.9.08 @ 12:35PM|#
Compare to this.
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/10/confronting-rac.html
There are going to be dark undercurrents in any political movement.
The question is, what do political leaders do about it?
|10.9.08 @ 12:35PM|#
So if a pipe bomber isn't as bad as a plane crasher, then are
ignorant rednecks that yell things at a video camera worse than a
pipe bomber who actually bombed things?
Good god, people, the desperation to prove the innocence of which
ever you choose of these weak-ass candidates is stunningly obtuse
and hackish.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 12:36PM|#
Has John McCain even said, "If you're voting for me because Obama is black, I don't want your vote"?
Telly|10.9.08 @ 12:39PM|#
Has Obama ever said, "If you're voting for me because McCain is white, I don't want your vote"?
|10.9.08 @ 12:39PM|#
Politics is an ugly business. Both sides are willing to do
whatever the hell they have to do to win -- promise free health
care, nationalize banks, steal even more in taxes, repeatedly lie
to us about their plans to take away our guns, etc.
They might also do something relatively innocuous compared to all
this theft and coercion, as is documented in this post.
|10.9.08 @ 12:39PM|#
So if a pipe bomber isn't as bad as a plane crasher, then
are ignorant rednecks that yell things at a video camera worse than
a pipe bomber who actually bombed things?
Bill Ayers circa 1970 was worse than these rednecks circa
2008.
If said rednecks clean themselves up and become English teachers
who do a lot of charity work in 30 years, nobody is going to say
boo if they hold a fundraising event for a candidate, or sit on the
same charity board.
|10.9.08 @ 12:40PM|#
"i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention screaming
kill her at malkin."
I don't want her killed. I think it would good for her to spend
some time in an internment camp, though.
That won't be necessary. She will have to live in a country when
Barack Obama is President for four to eight years. In her world,
that is internment.
|10.9.08 @ 12:46PM|#
Yes, prolefeed, if you advocate for left-of-center positions,
that's worse than inflaming racial paranoia for political
purposes.
Way to keep your persepctive.
I, Kahn O\'Clast|10.9.08 @ 12:46PM|#
The second video is excellent theater! The driver of the ATV is
clearly Sean Penn with a little make-up (or maybe we are finally
seeing him without). The woman is also clearly a famous actress
.... I just can't place her ...
Brilliant on the part of the Obama campaign!
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 12:52PM|#
Obama is clearly NOT a terrorist, but Ayers clearly was. You
can't possibly be serious, can you?
The point isn't that Ayers isn't or wasn't a terrorist. The point
is that people have a mental picture of what a terrorist is. Eric
Rudolph and Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber are/were terrorists
as well, but if you said to an average American "here's a box of 64
crayons, draw me a picture of a terrorist", they probably won't be
reaching for "peach" to draw the skin color.
So when you keep saying "Obama's bestest friend in the whole world
is a terrerrizzt!!", then show people a picture of Bill Ayres,
there's a sense that you may be overplaying the terrorist
card.
Has Obama ever said, "If you're voting for me because McCain is
white, I don't want your vote"?
Yeah, no one is going to talk about the reverse racism this year.
When African Americans, who normally only vote for Democrats at a
92% clip vote for Obama at a 96% clip, people will see just how
racist they are. Because every black candidate always has the
overwhelming support of the black community, regardless of party
and policies.
And for what it's worth, I don't think McCain needs to condemn
those supporters of his who support him based purely on his race.
He can't help that anymore than Obama can.
|10.9.08 @ 1:02PM|#
I just saw a headline that a genealogist has determined that Palin is related to Princess Di. It's a lock folks.
Telly|10.9.08 @ 1:06PM|#
"And for what it's worth, I don't think McCain needs to
condemn those supporters of his who support him based purely on his
race. He can't help that anymore than Obama can."
Then we agree Seitz, because that was my point, as I was responding
to the absurdness of the comment before mine.
|10.9.08 @ 1:12PM|#
----------------------------------
I get the impression that most of these people, if asked, would say
of Obama "well no, he's not technically a terrorist" based on the
same set of facts and conditions. But I think there's a large
number of them who probably believe that Obama is secretly
connected to terrorist organizations. Because he's, ya know, a
Muslim, and all Muslims are terrorists, right? I mean "Obama"?
"Hussein"? Really?
--------------------------------
That's just silly, so you think a large # of McCain supporters,
lets say that means more than half so that puts the number at about
25 million, think Obama is secretly connected to terrorist
organizations? Cause he's..you know....a muslim, and he has Hussein
in his name? You really, you know, think this? Not I'm not sure
who's dumber, the folks on the video or those that see the video
and think tens of millions of people really, you know, think that
way.
Seitz|10.9.08 @ 1:15PM|#
That's just silly, so you think a large # of McCain
supporters, lets say that means more than half so that puts the
number at about 25 million
A "large number" and "a majority" are not synonymous. 1 million is
a pretty large number, too, and more than enough to swing an
election.
I'm not sure who's dumber, the folks who think Obama's a terrorist,
or the people who immediately assume "a large number" is at least
25 million.
TallDave|10.9.08 @ 1:18PM|#
I'm sure if McCain had served on a board with Eric Rudolph and
launched his Senate career at his house, no one would be calling
him a terrorist. /eyeroll
Meanwhile, in deranged lefty news, The Atlantic's Andrew Sullivan
continues to insist Palin's son is actually that of Palin's teenage
daughter. And he's not just some guy at an Obama rally.
Gilbert Martin|10.9.08 @ 1:23PM|#
"Uh... no. A white trust fund kid who protested the Vietnam
War."
Obama is clearly NOT a terrorist, but Ayers clearly was. You can't
possibly be serious, can you?"
You have to discount anything Weigel says.
He's been a butt monkey for Obama from the get go.
|10.9.08 @ 1:28PM|#
For what it is worth....To those of you who are so very
concerned about Senator Obama's association with that 60's
terrorist -
Take a minute away from voicing your opinion and become a bit more
educated about the board that Obama and Ayres both served on - look
at where the money came from and who else served on that board.
Then look those people up and you might just discover that some of
the other 'terrorist associators' who served on that board went
there with some pretty impressive mainstream Republican
credentials.
Just mentionin' - dontcha know?
|10.9.08 @ 1:35PM|#
Why would a terrorist (white trust fund kid) like Ayers want to associate with good patriotic Americans like Mr. and Mrs. Obama? Ayers is lucky Obama didn't kick his white ass.
|10.9.08 @ 1:35PM|#
Hey, Gil.
Which cabinet post do you think Ayers will get?
On the one hand, his professional background would seem to make him
best suited for Secretary of Education.
But then, I understand he's done some work at the Pentagon,
too.
|10.9.08 @ 1:38PM|#
"Obama is clearly NOT a terrorist, but Ayers clearly
was."
Do terrorists generally give evacuation warnings to the people
occupying the places they are going to bomb? Doesn't that sort of
take the "terror" out of it all?
|10.9.08 @ 1:40PM|#
talldave, interesting story about the Palin pregnancies. Pictures and everything, Thanks for the tip. If Sullivan is wrong, then Bristol should give birth in about 3 months. If he is right, then due to the conflicting timelines, we should see a news story any day now about a miscarriage for Bristol's baby. Because if Trig is actually hers, she can't be 6 months along already. Time has to reveal the truth on this.
Telly|10.9.08 @ 1:42PM|#
"Which cabinet post do you think Ayers will get?"
Secretary of Homeland Security
|10.9.08 @ 1:48PM|#
Sorry Weigel, I have no sympthy for Obama on this one. I live in a heavily liberal area, and I hear moonbat accusations against conservative all the time. It's scary that the people in your videos believe what they say, but it's just as scary as those liberals who believe that conservatives literally want to steal social security checks from your grandma, literally believe that conservatives want to imprison all homosexuals, literally believe that conservatives want to restore slavery. Some of the accusation I have heard against Palin are beyond the pale, so should I be blaming the Obama campaign because someone who has his bumpersticker on his car made them?
Richard Upton Pickman|10.9.08 @ 1:49PM|#
You know what I like? Iron Maiden. I'm going to go listen to Piece of Mind and forget all about the election.
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 2:05PM|#
Meanwhile, in deranged lefty news, The Atlantic's Andrew
Sullivan continues to insist Palin's son is actually that of
Palin's teenage daughter. And he's not just some guy at an Obama
rally.
No, he doesn't. You have to completely distort what he has written
in order to come to that conclusion.
Gilbert Martin|10.9.08 @ 2:05PM|#
"Sorry Weigel, I have no sympthy for Obama on this one. I live
in a heavily liberal area, and I hear moonbat accusations against
conservative all the time. It's scary that the people in your
videos believe what they say, but it's just as scary as those
liberals who believe that conservatives literally want to steal
social security checks from your grandma, literally believe that
conservatives want to imprison all homosexuals, literally believe
that conservatives want to restore slavery. Some of the accusation
I have heard against Palin are beyond the pale, so should I be
blaming the Obama campaign because someone who has his
bumpersticker on his car made them?"
The leftist wackos have been hanging Bush in effigy for years,
making movies about assasinating him, etc etc.
I don't recall any of the liberal pundits denouncing any of it or
assigining blame to liberal Democrat politicians.
|10.9.08 @ 2:16PM|#
making movies about assasinating [Bush],
Oh, really? Since the are "movies" you can perhaps name one.
|10.9.08 @ 2:20PM|#
http://suzieqq.wordpress.com/2008/08/30/sarah-palin-is-not-the-mother-video-and-photos/
this is the "best" source I found in a quick search. It is
compelling IMO
BTW, if you look at the link, in the comments, there are a number
of links to pics of Sarah Palin during the last pregnancy and from
previous pregnancies.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 2:25PM|#
There was a film about Bush being assassinated--but it was made by a British woman and shown in Canada.
Gilbert Martin|10.9.08 @ 2:26PM|#
Oh, really? Since the are "movies" you can perhaps name
one.
See below:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/01/AR2006090100858.html
|10.9.08 @ 2:32PM|#
There must be plenty of medical records and obstetricians and
medical eye-witnesses prepared to testify to Sarah Palin's giving
birth to Trig. There must be a record of Bristol's high school
attendance for the past year. And surely, surely, the McCain camp
did due diligence on this. But the noise around this story is now
deafening, and the weirdness of the chronology sufficient to rise
to the level of good faith questions. So please give us these
answers - and provide medical records for Sarah Palin's pregnancy -
and put this to rest.
Sounds like Sullivan want McCain and Co. to prove a negative. Would
this be considered dirty pool by Obama supporters?
"But the noise around this story is now deafening, and the
weirdness of the chronology sufficient to rise to the level of good
faith questions. So please give us these answers - and provide
birth certificates, school attendance records, and a day by day of
Obama's adult life to prove he had no contacts with terrorists -
and put this to rest."
Sounds like the proof Sullivan wants could be deemed unsatisfactory
until we could see a video of Trig crowning. Maybe Sullivan has
fantasies of being one of the courtiers who would jostle and
fistfight to see the new prince actually slither out of the queen's
vagina.
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 2:36PM|#
Sounds like Sullivan want McCain and Co. to prove a
negative. Would this be considered dirty pool by Obama
supporters?
No, it actually sounds like Sullivan wants McCain and Co. (and
Obama and Co.; he was harping on Biden's medical records just a
week ago) to be forthcoming with certain types of records, on the
notion that information in them would be useful for voters to make
determinations about the health and truthfulness of the
candidates.
Proving a negative has nothing to do with it. If he *still* wasn't
satisfied after the records were released, then I'd see your point.
But it is awfully uncharitable to assume that he wouldn't be before
the fact.
|10.9.08 @ 2:49PM|#
Ele,
They want medical records to settle an ignorant rumor.
How's this: Barack Obama not the father of his children! Michelle's
girls fathered by Willie Horton! Why won't they give his their
medical records? What are they hiding?
Sullivan is just monstering. Partisan insanity doesn't put
unreasonable obligations on the targets of their insanity.
|10.9.08 @ 2:50PM|#
Regarding that link about the Palin daughter and the new
baby:
You know, I feel really creepy and low-down reading dirty political
games made by some no-name internet blogger about teenage girls and
whether they're sexually active at really young ages, babies with
Downs Syndrome, whether they're breastfeeding or not, and analyzing
a teenager girl's body changes. And yeah, I'd feel bad about
anything being said about Obama's little girls too. And I was
always disturbed about the things people used to say about Chelsea
Clinton, because she and my own daughter are the same age. I don't
care whether the political game in question is president of the
United States or the whole damn world.
Sorry, but I think there's a special place in hell (whatever hell
you believe in or don't believe in) for people who engage in this
sort of malicious political gossip without conscience and even seem
gleeful about it. That's really scummy. Some people really need to
meditate and do some soul searching. Or at the very least go
something decent for the world.
|10.9.08 @ 2:52PM|#
Defending Sullivan is idiotic. Anyone doing it should really rethink what they're engaging in.
|10.9.08 @ 2:59PM|#
The Palin Truth Movement
Burning jet fuel couldn't have given birth to a Down's baby! Her
uterus collapsed under a controlled birtholition! Todd Palin's
penis would have left a larger hole than that! Sarah Palin was
impregnated by a US fighter jet over Pennsylvania!
Why are you libertarians believing the government's lies!?!?!?!
|10.9.08 @ 2:59PM|#
"All McCain has to do is prove that Obama is a socialist
(and really, it's getting harder to deny), and I think he's got a
good chance at making enough Americans uncomfortable with Obama to
win the election."
I'm sorry, but a socialist?
Do they even still make them anymore? You are aware that it's 2008
and not 1968, right?
How old are you?
While we're at it, Abe Simpson, Got any "belt onion" stories to
tell?
Seriously though - message to baby-boomers: Grow the hell up and
stop being self-absorbed little children still scared of the
"socialist" boogeyman hiding in your closet.
Miller|10.9.08 @ 3:00PM|#
These people are angry because they've been condescended to by the media and the Pelosicrats their whole lives. The truth is that most Americans don't trust Obama. They don't like his politics and they're wary of his terrorist ties. But the media's "spin" makes most of them too cynical to even vote. And you blame Palin for giving normal people a chance to be heard? The real racism is on the left, with people like Obama's minister, but it's not politically correct to talk about it, is it?
Elemenope|10.9.08 @ 3:01PM|#
Defending Sullivan is idiotic. Anyone doing it should really
rethink what they're engaging in.
Oh calm down, Epi. Defending the point a guy makes is not the same
as defending the guy. I for one think that candidates should be
more forthcoming with information about themselves that would be
relevant for the voting public to know to assist decision-making,
and that that point is being made by Sullivan is rather irrelevant
to the matter of whether it is a good point or not.
|10.9.08 @ 3:12PM|#
Sullivan isn't really a "lefty." More of a fair-weather windbag. Circa March 2003, he was a seig-heiling Bush zealot.
|10.9.08 @ 3:17PM|#
These people are angry because they've been condescended to
by the media and the Pelosicrats their whole lives.
A couple things: I notice you don't defend the content of
statements of "these people." Hmmm. Apparently feeling
condescension from the media leads you to be bat-shit crazy instead
of seeking out truth in a rational manner. Odd that. Also, Pelosi
has been Speaker for only a couple years, and "these people" are
significantly older than two.
The truth is that most Americans don't trust Obama.
Source?
They don't like his politics
Actually his policy positions typically score quite well in polls,
and presidents in the past with similar policies have enjoyed wide
support.
and they're wary of his terrorist ties.
What terrorist ties? Let's put it on the table: do you actually
believe that the fact that Obama worked on the same committee as
Ayers long ago means that we have to fear Obama bombing public
buildings as president or ignoring Al Qaeda?
But the media's "spin" makes most of them too cynical to even
vote.
Actually, people are registering to vote in unprecedented numbers.
Let's make a bet: I say more people will vote in this election than
ever before. You?
And you blame Palin for giving normal people a chance to be
heard?
The problem with Palin isn't her "normalness." It's her lack of
command of the issues. I would love to see a qualified everyday
person running. Palin isn't that person.
The real racism is on the left, with people like Obama's
minister, but it's not politically correct to talk about it, is
it?
Actually, it was all people talked about for weeks. But people
finally arrived at the rational conclusion that "guilt by
association" is a fallacious way of thinking. And you know what? It
still is.
Gilbert Martin|10.9.08 @ 3:22PM|#
"Actually, people are registering to vote in unprecedented
numbers"
Even ones who don't actually exist.
Just check with ACORN on that.
|10.9.08 @ 3:28PM|#
Even ones who don't actually exist.
I was obviously referring to the existing ones.
Any other lame responses?
|10.9.08 @ 3:38PM|#
This is ridiculous. The one thing I beg to differ with in above comments is the idea that only fringe lefties have said extreme things about President Bush. Everyone on the left has done nothing but call President Bush Hitler and a Nazi for the past 6 years, including main stream people in the suburbs of Portland -- who are supposed to be intelligent ... so saying they have not, is almost an insult to a conservative. We have been a punching bag for the left as we "cling to our guns and religion." Michael Moore is revered and considered main stream by the left -- which to me is as scary and uninformed as the folks in this video. As a conservative, I think they made this video for the lowest common denominator -- which is good internet fodder. At the end of the day I wish both campaigns would give some straight talk, but honestly, neither candidate is equipped to handle this mess. I am voting for McCain because I don't want the most liberal bunch in the land running this country unchecked -- but am I excited about it? No. I think Obama is completely unqualified and I think McCain is a RINO. I think Joe Biden is a tool and I think Sarah Plain is awesome, but not ready for the highest office in the land. Whatever the outcome -- We're Screwed 08 -- BOTH parties failed to put forth a candidate anyone can really believe in.
|10.9.08 @ 3:38PM|#
Sorry, BDB. Party foul.
The correct sarcastic statement would be:
"ACORN will steal this election for Barack HUSSEIN Obama."
|10.9.08 @ 3:39PM|#
Wow, Gil, so an obscure British flick that will never be
released for general exhibition made by and even more obscure Limey
director with no discernible leftwing ties is "leftist
wackos...making movies about assasinating him."
Fom the plot description there is nothing anti-Bush about the film
at all. It's a straightfoeward dramatization about what might
happen if the President of the US was assassinate. Bad taste to use
a sitting prez? Maybe, but some "creative" types will do anything
to be edgy.
OK, that's one, you said, "movies". Another, if you please.
BDB|10.9.08 @ 3:40PM|#
It's going to be fun to watch the right wing bitch, moan, and whine about ACORN for four years. Just like it was fun to watch the left bitch, whine, and moan about Diebold and hanging chads for the last eight.
Tacos mmm...|10.9.08 @ 3:46PM|#
Todd Palin's penis would have left a larger hole than that!
Well, I have my quote-of-the-day.
Tacos mmm...|10.9.08 @ 3:48PM|#
Even ones who don't actually exist.
Just check with ACORN on that.
Of course, non-existant people don't actually show up to vote.
|10.9.08 @ 3:50PM|#
Reason refuses to have a quote-of-the-day because they know I would totally pwn it. I don't know why they've got to drink Hater-ade all the time. FACE ME, COWARDS!
|10.9.08 @ 3:52PM|#
Defending the point a guy makes is not the same as defending
the guy.
Technically true, but when the point is scurrilous, inherently
incredible, and pursued by the guy beyond all reason or sanity
because of a frothing hatred, then it gets pretty hard for your
defense of the point not to slop over onto the guy.
Really, can't we condemn Sully's point and all who pursue it?
-|10.9.08 @ 3:54PM|#
"Defending the point a guy makes is not the same as
defending the guy. "
unless they're defending a republican's point
|10.9.08 @ 3:54PM|#
The leftist wackos have been hanging Bush in effigy for
years, making movies about assasinating him, etc etc.
OK, since this is so equivalent, I'm sure we'll be seeing those
videos of people at Obama events shouting "kill him" and
"terrorist" and generally carrying on like this any minute now.
Yep, any minute now.
Tick tock.
|10.9.08 @ 3:58PM|#
People are just now noticing that Andrew Sullivan is partisan,
unfair, gullible, exciteable, and disrespectful?
Where were you people before the Iraq War? Where were you when he
wrote the day after the WTC attacks that Americans in "decadent
coastal enclaves" were going to form a Fifth Column to help al
Qaeda?
|10.9.08 @ 4:03PM|#
Everyone on the left has done nothing but call President
Bush Hitler and a Nazi for the past 6 years.
I stopped for a snack back in April of 05. Fried dough.
So hungry. So very hungry. bushitler. So hungry.
Gilbert Martin|10.9.08 @ 4:32PM|#
"It's going to be fun to watch the right wing bitch, moan, and
whine about ACORN for four years. Just like it was fun to watch the
left bitch, whine, and moan about Diebold and hanging chads for the
last eight."
Except that there is actual evidence that ACORN is involved in vote
fraud whereas all that Diebold and hanging chad stuff was just in
the liberal's heads.
|10.9.08 @ 4:51PM|#
WTF, I thought I safely locked those relatives away a long time
ago!!!
Actually, the video with the drunk hilljacks on the ATV has been
around at least a month, well before the McPalin campaign took its
recent particularly virulent turn.
lurker|10.9.08 @ 4:54PM|#
Vote fraud? There's evidence that somebody cast a fradulent ballot? I thought it was just phony registrations.
Mark Baker-Wright|10.9.08 @ 4:57PM|#
I find it interesting how much time is being devoted in these
comments to how partisan or biased a particular commentator
is.
EVERYONE has a bias of some sort. It's human nature. The trick
isn't to look for someone who's miraculously bias-free, but to make
sure that you're exposed to enough different viewpoints to discern
the truth.
Tacos mmm...|10.9.08 @ 5:04PM|#
Except that there is actual evidence that ACORN is involved in vote fraud whereas all that Diebold and hanging chad stuff was just in the liberal's heads.
If the evidence were that substantial, the justice department
wouldn't have had to fire so many DAs for failing to find
it.]
As long as the Republican party is focused on ACORN or voter fraud
as a reason they're losing elections, they're going to keep losing,
and look even more pathetic doing it.
|10.9.08 @ 5:12PM|#
>>>Except that there is actual evidence that ACORN is
involved in vote fraud whereas all that Diebold and hanging chad
stuff was just in the liberal's heads.>>>
I think that's fraudulent registrations. It's because people get
paid for each registration they turn in. It doesn't result in
actual votes. In fact, to the extent that it helps anyone, it would
help Republicans by wasting Dem resources and throwing off their
projections.
At least the lefty's came up with a conspiracy theory that actually
made sense, even if it wasn't true.
But anyway.
|10.9.08 @ 5:12PM|#
Untruths? John McCain is a coward who has to hide behind two women, a racist ex-beauty queen and a bottle blonde with connections to organized crime and the murder of an Arizona Republic journalist investigating friends of her father. If Obama had been sitting on a board and killed Benjamin Linder because Linder was trying to help the poor, I would call him a terrorist too. Oh wait...John McCain sat on a board and paid people to do that. "Why not ask David and Elizabeth Linder? Or the family of Sister Maureen Courtney? John McCain funneled money and guns and grenades and missile launchers to the terrorists through a right-wing fringe group." asked Irwin Tang. "The U.S. Council for World Freedom aided rebels trying to overthrow the leftist government of Nicaragua. That landed the group in the middle of the Iran-Contra affair and in legal trouble with the IRS, which revoked the charitable organization's tax exemption." Wrote the Associated Press. "The McCain campaign, in a continuing effort to link Barack Obama to domestic terrorism, released a statement Wednesday from a New York supporter, recounting how his family home was firebombed by the radical 1960s group founded by Obama supporter William Ayers. But the McCain supporter, John M. Murtagh, has his own ties to radical protesters: He served as a lawyer for a Catholic priest who led protests at an abortion clinic that turned violent." wrote The Wall Street Journal.
Orange Line Special goes easy |10.9.08 @ 5:34PM|#
Weigel writes: It reminds me of the collapse of the illegal
immigration issue. Yes, a majority of people told pollsters they
wanted "secure borders," but once they started associating those
opinions with beer-bellied Minutemen snooping around the AZ-Mexico
border, or mouthbreathing radio hosts like Michael
Savage...
In his own very special way, Weigel (accidentally) puts his finger
on the problem. Those images Weigel discusses were brought to us by
the MSM. They covered the issue in one way and spread lies designed
to support illegal activity.
In the case of BHO, the MSM has largely presented only one side to
him and has almost completely failed to discuss his radical links
and past.
Weigel's comments show little more than the fact that he believes
what he's told rather than being able to think for himself.
|10.9.08 @ 5:39PM|#
To blame it all on the candidates is to take away any sense
of personal responsibility or accountability.
This is just sheer denial and/or idiocy. McCain/Palin have decided
(and announced!) that they have no chance at winning if the focus
is on the economy so they have *chosen* to stoke baseless,
irrational fear. This is a deliberate choice reflected in their
rhetoric and adverts (though McCain evidently doesn't have the
courage to call Obama a terrorist-sympathizer to his face, so much
for the McCain myth on that front). You, sir/ma'am, are failing to
hold McCain and Palin *themselves* to the standards of
responsibility and accountability. They're stoking these flames,
chief. Only an idiot or a sheep would fail to see this. Which one
is it?
|10.9.08 @ 5:42PM|#
So I wonder if people will go bat shit crazy screaming racism the first time President Obama gets strung up and burned in effigy like previous presidents have.
|10.9.08 @ 6:06PM|#
I'll play because my sister in law could be the woman in the
first video (if sober) or in the second (if not). (You do realize
if you saw it that they were all drunk right?)
There is a streak of paranoia in American life (and for all I know
it's a universal of human existence, for some percentage of
people). Think "single bullet theory" and the entire industry
spawned by the belief that some set of actors official or not
conspired to kill Kennedy and then cover it up. Or that there is a
conspiracy among vaccine researchers to cover up the truth about
the cause of autism. Or that the Colgate Palmolive Co. is a
conspiracy of devil worshipers (which rumors were so persistent
that it had to change the logo that was used as "evidence" of its
cult-like tendencies).
My father was a left leaning paranoid, my brother is politically
neutral, and my sister in law is definitely rightward looking. What
distinguishes the left from the right probably has to do more with
cultural cues than it does with actual mental health.
But that does mean that leftists (and libertarians) are less
likely, for instance, to factor racism and guns into their
paranoia, and more likely to spend a lot of time reading deep tomes
about government spying. The former is just more likely to spiral
into something dangerous to actual people than the latter.
I would also argue, at least over the last 8 years, that to a
degree that I find very unsettling, this paranoia has been stoked
and encouraged by a president (and vice president) who seek to use
it to enlarge their power. That is, they have made it worse among
those who instinctively support them and have paranoid
tendencies.
Miller|10.9.08 @ 6:13PM|#
@Tracy:
You're pretty much on the money. But I still think you're
underestimating Palin.
|10.9.08 @ 6:32PM|#
They are what Margaret Fuller labeled the Nineteenth Century fundamentalists of her day: The enemies of youth; the enemies of life itself. Not enough attention has been paid to how crazy these people have become by the difference between McCain's and Obama's ages. This animus was first revealed (to me at least) when the egregious Palin went off on "backpacks" and student travel. And we still don't know for certain how many children she has. We do know their ages, though.
|10.9.08 @ 7:04PM|#
Look these folks have always been there. They lynched blacks, tortured and killed Emmett Till, supported MaCarthy, fought integration of the army, bombed abortion clinics, you name it. With his campaign dying McCain and Palin have chosen to summon Lincoln's dark angels. It's disgusting but it's what the Republican party has become in 2008. It why I chose to leave it. These people are a disgrace to America but don't expect McCain or Palin to point that out.
|10.9.08 @ 7:43PM|#
In his own very special way, Weigel (accidentally) puts his
finger on the problem. Those images Weigel discusses were brought
to us by the MSM. They covered the issue in one way and spread lies
designed to support illegal activity.
OLS, I consider you a dangerous asshole and be turned off by your
politics, and the entirety of my exposure to you is you expressing
your own message in your own manner.
|10.10.08 @ 2:38AM|#
"EVERYONE has a bias of some sort. It's human nature. The trick
isn't to look for someone who's miraculously bias-free, but to make
sure that you're exposed to enough different viewpoints to discern
the truth."
Mark, so true, so very very true.
|10.10.08 @ 6:49AM|#
PR wrote: "i did see video of a crowd at the dem convention
screaming kill her at malkin."
You misheard, they were yelling "Ooooh, get her!"
clonfert|10.10.08 @ 1:42PM|#
Burning jet fuel couldn't have given birth to a Down's baby!
Her uterus collapsed under a controlled birtholition!
that has to be the funniest thing I've ever read
|10.10.08 @ 6:02PM|#
Ayres was acquitted of any misdeeds over 30 years ago. In the
eyes of the law he is innocent. It is true that the lead prosecutor
in the case against him was disappointed that he could not get a
conviction. He just wrote a letter to the N.Y. Times saying that he
wanted to convict Ayres, but the jury disagreed with him. That is
our system of justice.
I want to ask McCain, "should we all be held accountable for our
associations with people who may have done really bad things 30
years before we met them"? How many politicians want to be held to
that standard? Let's see a show of hands.
|10.10.08 @ 6:41PM|#
My grandfather's middle name was Adolf, didn't make him a
Nazi!
These people make me sick. "Black ain't got nothing to do with it"
my ass.
|10.13.08 @ 12:51AM|#
Let me go on the record:
1) I live in the liberal loving bastian of san francisco
2) I am voting for john mccain.
I am voting for McCain for a variety of reasons. He is not the
perfect canditate, but he is better than the alternative. First and
foremost, I believe he wont raise taxes and obama will, and as much
as the dying republican message of low taxes and small government
still exists, McCain is the only politician in the race who
represents any minute thread of that philosophy.
Obama represents the further expansion of our government and
government sponsored social programs. . . something that will only
further destroy America.
so a leftist blogger when to a mccain rally and videotaped a few
comments from a few righties that think he is a terrorist. everyday
in the news and media, we see people on the left shouting and
printing equally despicable vile about the right. Everyday walking
through this city, I see people wearing t-shirts with barack obamas
mug on it, but they cannot really explain why they are voting for
obama, and all they know about sarah palin is that she supposedly
hates polar bears.
again, the bile on the left is just as bad, if not worse than what
a few nut jobs have said at a mccain rally.
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/10/12/crush-the-obamedia-narrative-look-whos-gripped-by-insane-rage/
mccain/palin 08. because its better than the alternative.
name withheld|10.17.08 @ 2:51AM|#
Still, this video by an Ohio liberal blogger is
bloodcurdling.
He's not known so much as an "Ohio liberal blogger" so much as he
is known as an "Ohio local crackpot". Seriously. Guy's got
problems. Frankly I'm surprised Reason linked to him. You should do
your research more thoroughly. If you were to have so much as
second-hand experience with his demeanor, you might understand why
he brings out the worst in people. I'll only say that it's unlikely
that partisanship was the impetus for all of those rally attendees
telling the guy to get the camera out of their faces and go away. A
meatspace griefer, that one.
|10.17.08 @ 10:46AM|#
Well, they certainly sound a little silly, but "bloodcurdling?"
Can you say hyperbole? People at political rallies are typically
reved up about their candidate, and against the other, and I have
seen similar things from Obama rallies, as well.
I usually come to Reason.com because the articles are more rational
than what I find elsewhere, but this was absolute tripe. I hope
this isn't a preview of what is to come - otherwise, I might have
to give up coming here and stick with other blogs and websites that
I trust.
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