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"...someone who has executive experience..."
Making his Palin announcement, John McCain raises an interesting weakness in his own resume: It's actually the person at the bottom of the ticket who has experience running things. When was the last time we had a Senator for Prez and a governor for Veep? Answer in the comments.
Update: Commenter Nick M gets the cigar:
The 1920 winners Senator Warren G. Harding & Governor Calvin Coolidge;
and the 1860 losers Senator Stephen A. Douglas & Former Governor Herschel Vespasian Johnson.
Nick actually pwned the challenge Friday. Sorry for the tardy update. He(?) is the fastest wiki in the west.
|8.29.08 @ 12:36PM|#
She has 18 months of executive experience, which gives her the
most out of McCain, Obama and Biden.
This was a really terrible choice, though.
robc|8.29.08 @ 12:38PM|#
She would have almost the exact same experience level as Calvin
Coolidge - 2 years as governor of a useless state.
More experience than Millard Fillmore and way, way, way more than
Chester A Arthur.
D.A. Ridgely|8.29.08 @ 12:45PM|#
Guessing at Tim's question [When was the last time we had a
Senator for Prez and a governor for Veep?] - Goldwater?
Ah, yes, the Goldwater Administration!
robc|8.29.08 @ 12:49PM|#
DA,
We are talking about candidates, not administrations.
dbcooper,
I think you have it. I always think Nixon won his race for governor
in the 60s, for some reason.
|8.29.08 @ 12:50PM|#
Goldwater?
Nope, Bill Miller was a Congressman.
Course, I don't know the answer, just the not-answer.
|8.29.08 @ 12:50PM|#
When was the last time we had a Senator for Prez and a
governor for Veep?
I don't think I'm old enough to answer this question.
D.A. Ridgely|8.29.08 @ 12:52PM|#
I'm going with Ford / Rockefeller. Following robc's logic, no one said anything about being elected, after all.
D.A. Ridgely|8.29.08 @ 12:53PM|#
Argh! But Ford was a Rep, not a Sen, wasn't he? Oh well, serves me right for thinking I could remember back that far.
|8.29.08 @ 12:56PM|#
If Nixon is discounted due to being veep prior to Pres, then some wiki'ing is going to be involved.
Elemenope|8.29.08 @ 12:57PM|#
More experience than Millard Fillmore and way, way, way more
than Chester A Arthur.
Did you mean to put her up against two of the *worst* presidents in
American history, or was that an accident?
|8.29.08 @ 1:01PM|#
"She has 18 months of executive experience, which gives her the
most out of McCain, Obama and Biden."
Well she has more than that since she was a Mayor previously.
Obviously that also points out that all "executive experience" is
not created equal.
I have experience in the management of a multi-million dollar
corporation which is currently viewed as one of the leaders of its
entire industry. :)
You can spin things anyway you want, the reality is often a whole
different story.
Tim Cavanaugh|8.29.08 @ 1:04PM|#
But Ford was already prez in 1976.
The answer may be "never." I'm still trying to find out myself.
Gilbert Martin|8.29.08 @ 1:06PM|#
I hear the Obama people are already saying that she doesn't have enough experiece - which isn't really a smart route for them to go since she has more experience than he does.
|8.29.08 @ 1:14PM|#
I hear the Obama people are already saying that she doesn't
have enough experiece - which isn't really a smart route for them
to go since she has more experience than he does.
It would be a bad move for them to actually campaign on that, but
it's a good move to make the McCain campaign drop the issue of
experience.
Remember when Hillary attacked Obama for "plagarizing" from his
campaign chair? You can't plagarize from your campaign chair; that
made about as much sense as accusing him of plagarizing from his
speechwriter. She lost that argument.
And yet, by having the argument, she took away Obama's ability to
use the "just words?" line that was working so well for him.
It was strategery, and it worked. Same thing here.
robc|8.29.08 @ 1:16PM|#
lmnop,
If you read the other thread, I did a quick research into
experience of the 9 veeps or took over as prez. And, btw, I scored
CAA as one of the better presidents from that group. He was so good
that he pissed off the GOP and they refused to renominate him.
Fillmore was on the negative side, I do agree, but wasnt that bad
(he sent Perry to open up trade with Japan, so he had that going
for him).
robc|8.29.08 @ 1:17PM|#
DA,
I can read the question just fine
"When was the last time we had a Senator for Prez and a governor
for Veep?"
I take "for" to mean "up for" as opposed to "as" which means
"already elected.
robc|8.29.08 @ 1:19PM|#
lmnop,
Im betting you, like joe, disagree with my characterization of
Coolidge as the best president of the 20th century.
robc|8.29.08 @ 1:23PM|#
lmnop,
Fillmore wasnt even one of the 2 worst presidents from that group
of 9. Both Johnson's rank below him, IMO.
Nick M|8.29.08 @ 1:27PM|#
It would appear that it's only happened twice before in the
history of the
Republican and
Democratic Parties:
The 1920 winners Senator Warren G. Harding & Governor Calvin
Coolidge;
and the 1860 losers Senator Stephen A. Douglas & Former
Governor Herschel Vespasian Johnson.
D.A. Ridgely|8.29.08 @ 1:34PM|#
Remember when Hillary attacked Obama for "plagarizing" from
his campaign chair?
Turns out she stole that from Joe Biden.
Gilbert Martin|8.29.08 @ 1:40PM|#
"It would be a bad move for them to actually campaign on that,
but it's a good move to make the McCain campaign drop the issue of
experience."
And why would that make McCain drop it?
He can well reply that BOTH he and his VP pick have more experience
than Obama.
McCain has military experience and a long time in the Senate. Obama
has nothing but a short time in the Senate and a "community
organizer" title on his resume.
|8.29.08 @ 1:47PM|#
Vespasian is nearly as ba-rocking a middle name as
Hussein.
"Tiberius". That is all.
|8.29.08 @ 1:56PM|#
And why would that make McCain drop it?
Because she was governor of Alaska for a couple years, and the rest
of her "experience" consists of being mayor of a town of 8100
people. That's less impressive experience than some Selectmen have
in Massachusetts. As opposed to Obama, who had a distinguished
recored in the state Senator for almost a decade.
Even if you want to argue that her experience trumps his, it's not
by enough to cast the two of them as the experience ticket.
But that's ok - it's a change election. He wasn't going to get
anywhere by pointing out that he's been in Washington forever
anyway.
|8.29.08 @ 2:01PM|#
The republican convention will almost certainly be interrupted by the re-flushing of New Orleans courtesy of hurricane Gustav. Any opinions on how this will affect either of the candidates?
Gilbert Martin|8.29.08 @ 2:11PM|#
"That's less impressive experience than some Selectmen have in
Massachusetts."
It may be "less impressive" in your opinion. But you don't speak
for the general public.
"As opposed to Obama, who had a distinguished recored in the state
Senator for almost a decade."
Where he didn't manage a single thing. She has actual management
experience and he doesn't.
"But that's ok - it's a change election"
The Dems HOPE it's going to be a "change election". They hope they
can get by by chanting "change" as a mantra without any specific
proof that they actually have anything that would substantively be
a "change" for the better.
The veneer on that has been wearing thin for some time now.
|8.29.08 @ 2:16PM|#
Ford was a congressman.
And that fucker pardoned Nixon.
I actually think that experience is important to a degree, but it
needs to be executive experience to matter. I don't
legislative experience matters all that much.
|8.29.08 @ 2:21PM|#
Episiarch,
Yes, who would Kirk pick as his VP? I'm thinking he would, in fact,
also pick Palin. [Insert Orion slave girl music]
|8.29.08 @ 2:26PM|#
The republican convention will almost certainly be
interrupted by the re-flushing of New Orleans courtesy of hurricane
Gustav. Any opinions on how this will affect either of the
candidates?
It will remind folks of "Brownie, you're doing a heckuva job". That
can't be good news for the GOP.
|8.29.08 @ 2:34PM|#
I think if FEMA and the Army Corp of Engineers have fixed things
in New Orleans well enough that it doesn't become a Third World
country when Gustav comes through, then it could help (or just not
hurt) McCain.
But I worked for the Army Corp of Engineers, and I'm not
optimistic.
|8.29.08 @ 2:45PM|#
ProL, Kirk shares power with no one. And his second in command would be Spock, clearly. Are there any Vulcan members of congress that he could pick?
|8.29.08 @ 2:49PM|#
Episiarch,
Work with me here, son. Kirk is running for president due to a time
travel accident that leaves him stranded here, alone. Spock is on
the Enterprise looking for Kirk, but he won't find him for
two seasons. I mean, years.
|8.29.08 @ 3:30PM|#
It's 3 a.m. and the communicator is beeping. Mr. Sulu is calling
about the Romulans crossing over into the Neutral Zone. Who do you
want running to the bridge?
I'm Captain Kirk, and I approved this message.
|8.29.08 @ 5:39PM|#
Gil,
It may be "less impressive" in your opinion. But you don't
speak for the general public. I'll put my record as an
election analyst up against yours any day, son. How's that "Hillary
owns the Democratic Party" thing coming?
Where he didn't manage a single thing. She has actual
management experience and he doesn't. Actually, he directed a
statewide voter registration effort that signed up 150,000
people.
The Dems HOPE it's going to be a "change election".
They've done polling on this, Gil. Given the choise of "someone who
will bring change" and "someone with experience," change wins by
2:1 this year - which should be obvious, given how Obama beat
Clinton.
|8.29.08 @ 5:57PM|#
You know, joe, I think the Clintons did kind of own the party at the outset. What Obama did is a little like what Reagan used to do with an opposition Congress--go to the people, screw Washington. I don't think that'll work as well in the general, but it overcame a Clinton bias in the DNC. Which in my mind is a good thing.
Gilbert Martin|8.30.08 @ 6:31PM|#
"I'll put my record as an election analyst up against yours any
day, son."
Your "record" as an "election analyist"?
That's funny. You don't HAVE any record as an "election analyist"
You're just another one of the babblers on the blog.
" How's that "Hillary owns the Democratic Party" thing
coming?"
Beats me - ask somebody who actually claimed that she did.
"They've done polling on this, Gil."
Uh hug - and 4 years ago the talking head proclaimed the exit polls
said that Kerry was going to win.
The only poll that counts is the one in the voting booth.
"Given the choise of "someone who will bring change" and "someone
with experience," change wins by 2:1 this year - which should be
obvious, given how Obama beat Clinton."
Not really, since NEITHER of them have any experience.
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