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Why Canadian Superheroes Are Hosers
Time after time, Canadian publishers conjured up superheroes that supposedly embodied the national spirit. Aside from Johnny Canuck, there is Nelvana of the Northern Lights (a white goddess in a mini-dress who protected the Arctic from "Kablunets, Nazi allies armed with Thormite Rays"), Captain Jack (an all-round athlete who battled Nazi saboteurs), Northern Light (a science fiction hero whose enemies were space aliens), Captain Canuck (who also fought space monsters as well as complex international banking conspiracies) and the similarly monikered Captain Canada (originally known as Captain Newfoundland, he defended the royal family from giant Japanese robots).
All these characters have their goofy charm, but let's face reality: none of them is a superhero of the first rank. They are not fit to hold the cape of Superman or Batman. They don't even have what it takes to be a sidekick to Wonder Woman or Captain America. Creating a Canadian superhero is rather like growing bananas in Nunavut. With enough ingenuity and willpower you can do it, but is it worth doing?
There is something about Canada that resists superheroes....
Brian Doherty looked at the persistence of the costumed do-gooder here and I made mine Marvel here.
Hat Tip: Arts & Letters Daily
|6.20.07 @ 9:27AM|#
My Canadian colleagues would say "Canada does not need superhero's because we don't have any serious problems. They'd be like the Maytag repairman." Eh?
|6.20.07 @ 9:27AM|#
what was the Canadian mutant superhero team, Alpha Flight, I
think? Puck, Sasquatch...
Marvel creation though, via X-men.
|6.20.07 @ 9:27AM|#
What, no Alpha Flight? Just because Marvel is an American publisher? Discrimination!
|6.20.07 @ 9:37AM|#
Well, there is Dudley Do-Right.
Canada has no serious problems? No, they aren't verging on
collapse, but I can't think of a single Canadian I know who doesn't
have a vast array of complaints.
James \"Logan\" Howlett|6.20.07 @ 9:47AM|#
Hey bub, don't be messing with us Canuckleheads! We take in your dissidents, like U.S. Agent, Beta Ray Bill, and one of the former Spider-babes. Not to mention America's favorite #1 mutant of three box-office hits is from the Great White North.
SugarFree|6.20.07 @ 9:49AM|#
But if Canada could come up with its own superheroes, they might
have been creative enough on their own to destroy the one thing all
Canadians seem to truly love: bitching about the pervasiveness of
American culture.
Don't get me wrong. I've enjoyed every visit to Canada and have
liked the vast majority of Canadians I've met, but a large part of
their national character seems to be invested in complaining about
America(ns). So large a part, I can barely conceive of what Canada
would be without us.
|6.20.07 @ 9:49AM|#
But doesn't the wolverine story just make the thesis here
stronger. He was part of a secret Canadian military project.
I dare you to say that three times without laughing.
Robert|6.20.07 @ 9:58AM|#
What about that Eskimo superhero character I read about decades ago in the WSJ who would lose all his powers when he drank?
|6.20.07 @ 9:59AM|#
SugarFree,
Canada. The Un-America. Crisp and clean and no caffeine. Never had
it, never will [insert deep Trinidadian laugh].
|6.20.07 @ 10:05AM|#
The Canadian Northstar was the first openly gay superhero - they have that going for them.
|6.20.07 @ 10:07AM|#
Superheroes are a cultural resource unique to the US. Canada had rich veins of comic actors, which they mined and exported to great effect in the 70's and 80's. But it seems like they might have tapped it out.
D.A. Ridgely|6.20.07 @ 10:12AM|#
Don't forget Waitenlinea, goddess of nationalized health
care.
or Francophonia, with the power of rendering all signs bilingual so
non-English speakers will know what red octagonal traffic signs
indicate.
e|6.20.07 @ 10:17AM|#
Don't forget Waitenlinea, goddess of nationalized health
care.
I liked the episode where Waitenlinea on average, somehow outlived
Dynamic Entreprenuria, the goddess of US Health Care!
SugarFree|6.20.07 @ 10:20AM|#
Pro Libertate,
Thanks for reminding me... My grandmother has a set of those upside
down Un-cola glasses I need to get from her before we send her to
the home.
Episiarch|6.20.07 @ 10:21AM|#
I'm now waiting for some indignant Canucks to get defensive and
make this thread really entertaining. "We burned down the White
House in 1814!"
Yes, I have really heard that from Canadians before.
|6.20.07 @ 10:33AM|#
Yeah, I second the astonished no-mention of Alpha Flight.
...and the Red Green show is/was the worst television show ever.
...ever!
|6.20.07 @ 10:33AM|#
Episiarch,
Don't forget - they also bombed the Baldwins!
They're not even a real country anyway.
|6.20.07 @ 10:39AM|#
You left out the best part:
"To protect Canada's trade balance during World War II, the
government forbade the importation of fiction periodicals, creating
a temporary niche for Canadian publishers of pulp fiction magazines
and comic books. When normal cross-border trade resumed, the market
for Canadian comic books collapsed."
In other words, the Canadian superhero, like (much as I hate to
admit it) most other other "Canadian content," was a creature of
government policy and would disappear as soon as the state support
was removed.
(You'd think Canadian workers would have had better things to be
doing during a war than drawing comic books, wouldn't you? Like
making armaments--or going to Europe to actually fight.)
Jennifer|6.20.07 @ 10:39AM|#
Canada is the finest country that ever was or will be, and Canadians are superior to Americans in every way. And I'm not just saying this because I'm slightly intimidated by my poutine-wielding Canadian-emigre boss, either.
|6.20.07 @ 10:51AM|#
Sugarfree wrote:
But if Canada could come up with its own superheroes, they
might have been creative enough on their own to destroy the one
thing all Canadians seem to truly love: bitching about the
pervasiveness of American culture.
Don't get me wrong. I've enjoyed every visit to Canada and have
liked the vast majority of Canadians I've met, but a large part of
their national character seems to be invested in complaining about
America(ns). So large a part, I can barely conceive of what Canada
would be without us.
I grew up in Toronto, immigrated to the US in the seventies and and
have never lived there since, but visit a couple of times a year.
My wife and I have concluded that the entire nature of Canadian
cultural and national identity consists of not being American and
being proud of it. Like every small town they feel constrained to
point out every Canadian pianist, baseball player and actor (at
least on the radio).
On the other hand, because I live in Detroit I listen to CBC 2
radio a lot because they have good classical music during the
day.
Urkobold™|6.20.07 @ 10:55AM|#
SHATNER IS CANADIAN. KIRK IS AMERICAN. THERE IS NO DEEPER STATEMENT TO BE MADE THAN THAT.
VM|6.20.07 @ 10:59AM|#
Canada: Where the Female Impersonators are Played by
Women.
(and what the URKOBOLD said.)
/trembles in fear. shuffles off
|6.20.07 @ 11:02AM|#
Canada is a great source of raw material.
Example - Pam Anderson.
Canadian made. Perfected by American science.
|6.20.07 @ 11:04AM|#
Canada spawned RUSH. They don't need to create anything
else.
I would've worded that: "They shouldn't be allowed to create
anything else."
SugarFree|6.20.07 @ 11:06AM|#
Geoff Nathan,
I'm from Kentucky. They do the "look who's from here!" crap in the
paper constantly.
I love Toronto. I've gone mostly to do research at the Merrill
Science Fiction collection and work stuff. They have the best used
bookstores for science fiction I've ever found.
Episiarch|6.20.07 @ 11:07AM|#
URKOBOLD speaks the greatest truth. Though I must add that many members of the cast of Firefly are Canadian.
|6.20.07 @ 11:09AM|#
Episiarch,
But it's implied that the departure from Earth-that-Was was a
cooperative effort between the U.S. and China. Canada clearly was
destroyed at some point before then. Therefore, the characters were
all descended from Americans.
Urkobold™|6.20.07 @ 11:11AM|#
DAN ACKROYD IS CANADIAN. ELWOOD BLUES IS AMERICAN. AND SO ON. THE URKOBOLD IS AMAZED AT HOW EASILY CANADIANS CAN IMITATE AN AMERICAN ACCENT.
Episiarch|6.20.07 @ 11:11AM|#
Therefore, the characters were all descended from
Americans.
ProL,
Well, obviously. I didn't even think it needed to be said ;-)
Episiarch|6.20.07 @ 11:17AM|#
ProL,
Why would anyone ever make a movie about a Canadian?
Ba-dum-dum. I'll be here all week. Don't forget to tip your
waitress.
megs|6.20.07 @ 11:21AM|#
I love Canadians. I married one and moved to Ottawa. But yes,
their superheroes suck. The forced "Canadian content" often sucks.
It often strikes me that Americans have no problem incorporating a
lot of other countries' material into American products, but the
standards for what is "Canadian" are either so poor (American movie
filmed in Toronto-as-NYC) or so rigid (docudrama about the guy who
campaigned for national health care in Canada) that the whole
concept is rife with humor.
That said, I love Acadieman, even though I don't
speak French. My husband is Acadian, though, and I can vaguely
understand it. Naturally, though, the only good Canadian superhero
isn't actually a superhero.
My feeling is that the best stuff Canada comes up with are niche
works, nothing with the broad appeal of, say, Superman. And if
something does have a broad appeal, it immediately goes south to
make money.
D.A. Ridgely|6.20.07 @ 11:22AM|#
As always, URKOBOLD has put his claw finger on the
heart of the matter, in the spirit of which:
Michael J. Fox - Canadian ..... Alex P. Keating - American
Lorne Greene - Canadian ..... Ben Cartwright - American
Raymond Burr - Canadian ..... Perry Mason - American
Donald Sutherland - Canadian ..... "Hawkeye" Pierce -
American
Raymond Massey - Canadian ..... Abe Lincoln - American
Chief Dan George - Canadian ..... Chief Dan George in any movie -
American Indian
Keanu Reeves - Canadian ..... Bill or Ted, Neo - who cares?
|6.20.07 @ 11:42AM|#
Say, has an American ever played a Canadian on
screen?
Ummm, Nelson
Eddy played a Mountie in Rose-Marie.
I'm out. :)
|6.20.07 @ 11:46AM|#
"Canada: Where the Female Impersonators are Played by
Women."
Y'know, I'm no fan of Celine Dion, but that's just
mean.
|6.20.07 @ 11:47AM|#
Isaac,
That's a relief. I was starting to suspect some sort of Yukon
conspiracy.
Brenden Fraser played Dudley Do-Right in the eponymous movie.
|6.20.07 @ 11:48AM|#
In the Kirk / Shatner imbroglio, I'd like to note that Kirk is
from Iowa, and Iowa is the Canada of the United States.
Look, Canada doesn't suck. Anyplace that produces folk like David
Cronenberg, Michael Ironside, Peter North, Kristin Kreuk and Leslie
Nielson is an okay place in my book. But for every Neil Young there
is a Celine Dion. For every Leonard Cohen there is a Barenaked
Lady. For every awesome nudie bar there is a Howie Mandel.
If Canada was a Simpsons character it would be Ned Flanders. If
Canada was a band it would be U2. If Canada was a Beatle it would
be Paul McCartney.
|6.20.07 @ 11:52AM|#
I, for one, love Canada and am entirely willing to conquer
Greenland on Canada's behalf.
I'm just sayin'.
LarryA|6.20.07 @ 11:56AM|#
Canada has no serious problems? No, they aren't verging on
collapse, but I can't think of a single Canadian I know who doesn't
have a vast array of complaints.
But they're waiting on the government to solve them.
Superheros are by nature individuals, and mostly vigilantes.
Canadians don't look up to either.
|6.20.07 @ 12:02PM|#
I, for one, love Canada and am entirely willing to conquer
Greenland on Canada's behalf.
I dunno, PL, I'm going to be torn if Canada and Denmark go to war
over that disputed island in the Greenland Passage.
I have ties to both places.
I say, what does the US have to do when two NATO allies end up at
war with each other.
VM|6.20.07 @ 12:03PM|#
Medai - check out destijl @ 11:48. Comparing anything to u2
is one of the cruelest things out there.
wow. :)
ProGLib - We know you have your sights on Grønland, where you're
gonna open up a bar and casino...
hier is (was?) one of
the all time bestest places on Vancouver Island!
|6.20.07 @ 12:05PM|#
Canadians are just too sarcastic to take any superhero
seriously.
Comedy is Canada's forte and always will be.
Any Canadian superhero would be the immediate target of 30,000,000
jokers.
Same goes for super-villains. Pro Libertate mentioned the only
character that Canadians have any sympathy for - Dudley Do-Right -
but that's because he is such an obvious joke. And who's Dudley's
arch-enemy? Snidely Whiplash, of course. If Lex Luthor were
Canadian, Superman would never even notice him.
|6.20.07 @ 12:07PM|#
LarryA | June 20, 2007, 11:56am |
Yes, when Canadians were asked to pick the "Greatest Canadian
Ever", did the pick the "Father of Confederation", Sir John A
MacDonald or WWI flying ace Billy Bishop, VC?
Or even discoverer of insulin and Nobel Laureate Dr Frederick
Banting?
No, they picked the "Father of Medicare" TC (Tommy) Douglas. Better
known to Americans as Kieffer Sutherland's Grandfather. :)
|6.20.07 @ 12:20PM|#
I love Canadians. Spent a lot of time up there drinking. They're friendly, funny, well educated people who make great barroom conversationalists. But, until their GDP surpasses the state of Texas, I'll just smile and nod when the topic shifts to healthcare and economics.
|6.20.07 @ 12:22PM|#
Aresen,
Is Snidely Whiplash a Canadian? I bet he's American.
Canadians have produced an insanely disproportionate amount of
North American humor and should be proud of it.
I think we should merge the U.S. and Canada and call the new
country, "Canada" but keep acting like the U.S. People would always
give us the benefit of the doubt, that way--"But it's Canada! There
must be a good reason for them invading us!"
|6.20.07 @ 12:41PM|#
Don't forget...
William Shatner (Canadian) .... Captain James T. Kirk (American),
T.J. Hooker (American), and let's not forget Denny Crane
(red-blooded-American)
Edward|6.20.07 @ 12:42PM|#
Why did Gillespie choose to run this fluff piece of shit from
Arts & Letters Daily and ignore this substantial piece that
challeges libertarian verities?
Protectionism is a threat to the U.S. economy. Saving globalization
requires that its gains are spread more widely. The best way:
redistribute income... more»
Edward|6.20.07 @ 12:45PM|#
We Americans relied on the U.S. Army to settle the West. Canadians let the Hudson's Bay Company do it (with just a little help from the RCMP). Go figure
|6.20.07 @ 1:03PM|#
"Is Snidely Whiplash a Canadian? I bet he's American."
I believe he's a Bay Street banker - i.e. from Toronto.
Hating Toronto is part of being Canadian. Especially if you're from
Toronto.
SxCx|6.20.07 @ 1:39PM|#
Don't get me wrong. I've enjoyed every visit to Canada and
have liked the vast majority of Canadians I've met, but a large
part of their national character seems to be invested in
complaining about America(ns). So large a part, I can barely
conceive of what Canada would be without us.
As a lifelong Canadian resident, I can affirm all of the
above.
It's true: our culture is a portmanteau of American and British
influence, with little genuine substance outside of well-worn
stereotypes like Mounties and maple syrup. The craziest, most
infuriating part about all of this, is that cultural regulation
still hold use to these same absurd, long-forgotten
standards.
Fuck, don't get me started.
|6.20.07 @ 1:43PM|#
Canada and the U.S. are jointly successful. Our cultures are intertwined. Canada is no less influential on North American culture than, say, California (which has a similar population). It's just trying to be something entirely separate than gives Canadians heartburn, because it's so clearly not true.
VM|6.20.07 @ 1:46PM|#
Desired:
French culture
Brit gov't
US know how
Attained:
US culture
French gov't
Brit Know how
|6.20.07 @ 2:23PM|#
Canada is actually a mess of contradictions (much like any
country I suppose).
While there are havens of drug tolerance that make libertarians
hearts flutter (in Toronto, I'm told, quietly smoking a joint in
public wil be ignored while in Vancouver the stuff is almost
mandatory) stories like
this (from today's brickbats) demonstrate that
anti-drug hysteria to rival any in America is alive and well in the
heartland.
Likewise with military matters. While the "urban elites" evince a
disdain for nationalism and the military ethos there is another
military culture in which the old spirit of Vimy Ridge and D-Day
are alive. This is where the guys doing the heavy lifting in
Afghanistan right now are coming from. When anyone even bothers to
report their deaths in the US media they are nameless "NATO
troops". Their families and communities back home know good and
well where they came from though.
Edward|6.20.07 @ 2:47PM|#
Canadians are healthier and live longer than we Americans do, and they would never elect George W. Bush.
Edward|6.20.07 @ 2:53PM|#
World Life Expectancy Chart
http://geography.about.com/library/weekly/aa042000b.htm
Country 2000 L.E. 1998 L.E.
Canada 79.4 79.2
United States 77.1 76.1
|6.20.07 @ 2:58PM|#
If you really want to annoy a canadian, point out that even though most canadians define themselves in terms of "not being American", they as a whole, in speech, dress and culture are more like America than any other nation on earth.
|6.20.07 @ 3:01PM|#
Do The Hardy Boys count as Superheroes? When I was growing up in the sixties I read all the books. They were written by a Canadian.
robc|6.20.07 @ 3:01PM|#
Sugarfree,
I'm from Kentucky. They do the "look who's from here!" crap in
the paper constantly.
You, me, Clooney, Lincoln, and the guy who knocked up Anna Nicole
Smith. Did I miss anyone?
Edward|6.20.07 @ 3:03PM|#
PISA 2003 Mean Scores in Mathematics
OECD Countries
Finland 544
Korea 542
Netherlands 538
Japan 534
Canada 532
Belgium 529
Switzerland 527
Australia 524
New Zealand 523
Czech Republic 516
Iceland 515
Denmark 514
France 511
Sweden 509
Austria 506
Germany 503
Ireland 503
Slovak Republic 498
Norway 495
Luxembourg 493
Poland 490
Hungary 490
Spain 485
United States 483
Portugal 466
Italy 466
Greece 445
Turkey 423
Mexico 385
Source: OECD, Learning for Tommorrow's World: First Results from
PISA 2003
Scooby|6.20.07 @ 3:03PM|#
Edward,
From the data you provided, it appears that the US is increasing
its life expectancy at a much greater rate than is Canada (1.0 yr
increase in the US from 1998-2000 vs. 0.2 yr increase in Canada in
the same period). At that rate, we should have passed them sometime
in the last couple years. Maybe single-payer health care isn't so
great for the elderly.
Got any fresher data?
|6.20.07 @ 3:06PM|#
It's interesting to that Canadians loudly denounce nationalism,
while their younguns plaster the Maple Flag on their backpacks when
they travel.
Of course, that's just so nobody'll think they're 'Murricans.
robc|6.20.07 @ 3:10PM|#
Scooby,
CIA World Factbook has 2007 #s as 78 for US and 80.34 for Canada.
So we havent gained any ground in last 7 years.
Interestingly, our men are only 1 year behind Canadian men, but our
women are 3 years behind.
|6.20.07 @ 3:12PM|#
The Hardy Boys were explicitly American in the books (from the
maybe Bayport, New York, maybe mythical Bayport). And I think there
was more than one author under the Dixon label, though I'm not sure
about that.
Isaac,
Of course they paste the maple leaf everywhere when they travel!
Otherwise, terrorists would see them as obviously American and, um,
terrorize them. As Canadians, they're safer. Though it's probably
the case that every CIA operative who is from the U.S. carries a
Canadian passport.
D.A. Ridgely|6.20.07 @ 3:22PM|#
Country 2000 L.E. 1998 L.E.
Canada 79.4 79.2
United States 77.1 76.1
Sure, but that's because of the unfair score we got from the East
German judge.
Postmodern Sleaze|6.20.07 @ 3:30PM|#
"It's interesting to that Canadians loudly denounce nationalism,
while their younguns plaster the Maple Flag on their backpacks when
they travel.
Of course, that's just so nobody'll think they're
'Murricans."
Most of the Americans I know claim they're Canadian when they go
abroad. And when you're from Minneapolis (south Toronto) or Seattle
(south Vancouver), that's pretty easy to do.
|6.20.07 @ 3:36PM|#
Most of the Americans I know claim they're Canadian when
they go abroad.
This is not really necessary. This is a throwback to the Vietnam
era when anti-Americanism was prevalent. Even Canadian
Anti-Americanism had a different hue in those days.
There are few places in the world where Americans (as opposed to
the American Government) are not liked. Of course, if you're an
American asshole you won't be liked anywhere, even at home.
Scooby|6.20.07 @ 3:38PM|#
It's damn near impossible for a Texan to pass for Canuck- once the 2nd person plural pronoun is called for in conversation, the jig is up, even if you end every sentence with "eh?"
|6.20.07 @ 3:48PM|#
Isaac,
Actually, I agree. We're far, far more popular around the world
than domestic politics or the media would suggest. It's partially
because of the understanding that individuals and governments are
two different things, and partially an understanding that we're in
a difficult position--whatever the U.S. does, it pisses someone
off.
Also, I don't doubt that Islamic terrorists would be perfectly
willing to off Canadians.
Edward|6.20.07 @ 3:52PM|#
Prisoners (per 1,000 people):
United States 4.2
United Kingdom 1.0
Germany 0.8
Denmark 0.7
Sweden 0.6
Japan 0.4
Netherlands 0.4
Death row inmates:
United States 2,124
Japan 38
Europe and Canada 0
Percent of households with a handgun:
United States 29%
Finland 7
Germany 7
Canada 5
Norway 4
Europe 4
Netherlands 2
United Kingdom 1
Murders committed with handguns annually:
United States 8,915
Switzerland 53
Sweden 19
Canada 8
United Kingdom 7
Murder rate (per 100,000 people):
United States 8.40
Canada 5.45
Denmark 5.17
Germany 4.20
Norway 1.99
United Kingdom 1.97
Sweden 1.73
Japan 1.20
Finland 0.70
Murder rate for males age 15-24 (per 100,000 people):
United States 24.4
Canada 2.6
Sweden 2.3
Norway 2.3
Finland 2.3
Denmark 2.2
United Kingdom 2.0
Netherlands 1.2
Germany 0.9
Japan 0.5
Rape (per 100,000 people):
United States 37.20
Sweden 15.70
Denmark 11.23
Germany 8.60
Norway 7.87
United Kingdom 7.26
Finland 7.20
Japan 1.40
Armed robbery (per 100,000 people)
United States 221
Canada 94
United Kingdom 63
Sweden 49
Germany 47
Denmark 44
Finland 38
Norway 22
Japan 1
Urkobold™|6.20.07 @ 4:00PM|#
YES, YES, THE UNITED STATES IS A HELLHOLE. URKOBOLD IS SURE THAT THOSE NUMBERS WILL IMPROVE IF YOU WILL SIMPLY LEAVE.
Edward|6.20.07 @ 4:01PM|#
I would trade our superheros for some improvements in the quality of our life any day. But then, I'm not a stary-eyed libertarian American nationalist. I can count.
|6.20.07 @ 4:02PM|#
You, me, Clooney, Lincoln, and the guy who knocked up Anna
Nicole Smith. Did I miss anyone?
Hunter S. Thompson and Col. Sanders.
Edward|6.20.07 @ 4:08PM|#
Home ownership:
Ireland 82% Japan 60
Spain 80 Portugal 59
Luxembourg 77 United States 59
Norway 73 Finland 58
Belgium 72 Sweden 55
Greece 72 France 54
Italy 68 Netherlands 46
United Kingdom 67 Germany 40
Canada 64 Switzerland 29
Denmark 60
VM|6.20.07 @ 4:08PM|#
um... Postmodern - Buffalo , NY would be south Toronto.
and minneapolis lies to the north of toronto.
|6.20.07 @ 4:12PM|#
Edward,
We have more people on the Eastern seaboard than they have in the
whole country. I understand that the numbers you threw out are
per-capita, but when you have a bigger population in a smaller
space you're bound to have greater social friction. The Canadian
way works great for Canada, we are just far to populated and
diverse to pull it off here.
I would also add that if you think Canadians are inherently more
peaceful, you have never been in Thunderbay on a Saturday night.
Home of the scariest damn bar I've ever been in.
|6.20.07 @ 4:14PM|#
Since we Canucks have such good math scores, we also know how to
count:
GDP per capita (2005)
4. US $43,444
9. Canada $35,494
Source: Wikipedia (Citing IMF list)
D.A. Ridgely|6.20.07 @ 4:32PM|#
Apropos of Aresen's comment, Andrew Sullivan just posted
this fascinating map of the U.S. as its states compare to
various other nations' entire GDP. Of course, most of that money
ends up going to people named Walton, Gates or Buffet, but
still...
Canada, btw, gets Texas.
|6.20.07 @ 4:43PM|#
D.A. Ridgely,
I saw that earlier and loved it. Did you check out the rest of the
maps on strange
maps? Awesome blog!
|6.20.07 @ 4:49PM|#
D.A. Ridgely
Considering the number of snowbirds there, I think we should have
gotten Florida.
|6.20.07 @ 4:51PM|#
Where is that table that shows Canadian metrics without
freeloading on the us consumer? I can't find it.
Let's see of the top 100 prescribed drugs, percent developed in
Canada or with any marginal contribution from Canadian consumers=
?
Number of Canadians assaulted who were prohibited by law from
defending themselves = ?
The Canadian model is awesome! As soon as we have a relatively free
market Mars spilling free milk and honey into our borders, I bet we
could catch up real fast. We should get working on that.
|6.20.07 @ 4:55PM|#
You know, Edward, I don't usually use "love it or leave it" talk
but many of the countries on your lists (you do love making lists,
don't you?) have very liberal immigration policies.
When I hear someone bitch about America the thought that pops into
my head is "wow, if it's so fucking bad, why doesn't he leave?". As
noted above I never say it out loud.
I also try not to feed trolls but you are getting annying.
Just in case you don't realize it, most of us are perfectly aware
of the numbers you quote. We also know how to view them in context
and consider cultural differences and not just see them in the
simplistic terms you do.
We also know that for the most part differences in counting methods
make many comparisons utterly meaningless.
|6.20.07 @ 5:03PM|#
de stijl,
Did you see the map of Middle Earth on the real Earth? It implies
that the U.S. is the location of the Undying Lands. Making Indians
the elves, I suppose.
e|6.20.07 @ 5:08PM|#
Shorter Isaac Bartram:
Don't confuse the issue with facts, and anyway, statistics have a
well known liberal bias, and also we have a lot of lazy poor people
with bad hygene.
|6.20.07 @ 5:15PM|#
e
RE: poor people with bad hygene
Let's just say you don't want to be downwind of me after a day at
the barn. ;)
Gilbert Martin|6.20.07 @ 5:18PM|#
"Where is that table that shows Canadian metrics without
freeloading on the us consumer? I can't find it."
Bingo.
A good chunk of Canada's economny is based on exporting natural
resource commodoties - and the US is a big customer.
Also, Cananda, like the other socialist nations of western Europe
that the liberals are so enamoured of would not be in existence
today as an independent nation state if it had not been getting the
benefit of our military protection for the last 60 years or so and
counting.
Wow, Plagerize Much?|6.20.07 @ 5:20PM|#
Comment here, today, by PL:
de stijl,
Did you see the map of Middle Earth on the real Earth? It implies that the U.S. is the location of the Undying Lands. Making Indians the elves, I suppose.
Comment there, two weeks ago:
Does that mean the Americas are the Undying Lands? Were the Native Americans actually Elves (and three Hobbits and a Dwarf)?
Comment by Jason - June 4, 2007 @
Gilbert Martin|6.20.07 @ 5:22PM|#
"The Canadian way works great for Canada, we are just far to
populated and diverse to pull it off here."
Well it doesn't work so great for some Canadians - that's why they
come running down to the US to get timely medical treatment that
they can't get at home.
Apparantly, statistical averages of life expectancies aren't
sufficient to make them feel satisfied about their personal
situation.
|6.20.07 @ 5:26PM|#
Well, citing statistics without analyzing their meaning, their
validity, or the honesty of the reporting nations or willfully
ignoring the obvious falsity of what you are trying to imply might
just be a bit disingenuous.
Are there issues in the U.S.? Yes. Are there issues everywhere
else? Yes. Rather have our issues than pretty much any other
country's, especially when you take into consideration our sheer
size and diversity.
Egad. What an incredible display of intellectual dishonesty!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Um, since I never saw Jason's comment, I'd appreciate it if you'd
take your nastiness elsewhere. It's a rather obvious conclusion,
wouldn't you say? In fact, it's occurred to me and others before,
given that Tolkien clearly viewed Middle Earth as being in Europe.
What level of asininity are we trying to achieve today? It's
"plagiarize", incidentally.
|6.20.07 @ 5:43PM|#
Well it doesn't work so great for some Canadians - that's
why they come running down to the US to get timely medical
treatment that they can't get at home.
Agreed. Ask the First Nations how the whole Canadian system is
working out for them. Which by the way is a great way to flummox a
Canadian in a debate - Just ask if their statistics include the
Inuit.
But, that being said, on a whole their system works about as well
for them as ours does for us. You just can't make an apples to
apples comparison.
Apparantly, statistical averages of life expectancies aren't
sufficient to make them feel satisfied about their personal
situation.
Agreed again. Just about every Canadian I have meet at one point or
another bounces his plan for stashing cash in the US off of me.
e|6.20.07 @ 5:52PM|#
I can see it now,
"According to a new Cato Institute study, adjusted for our high
level of defense spending necessary to protect Canada, the US's
life expectancy is actually the highest of any industrialized
nation."
|6.20.07 @ 6:22PM|#
A good chunk of Canada's economny is based on exporting
natural resource commodoties - and the US is a big
customer.
Funny, I hear a similar argument from Canadian Nationalists all the
time, to the effect that we should forbid the export of raw
materials and make companies do manufacturing here.
Strange how difficult Ricado's Law of Comparitive Advantage is
understood on both sides of the 49th
parallel.
|6.20.07 @ 6:34PM|#
Aresen,
No doubt--we're all crazy here in North America. Good thing we're
less crazy than the rest of the world. Though we're working on
that.
But if things ever get too weird up there, you're always welcome in
Canada South (query: at any given time, how large a percentage of
the Canadian citizenry is actually in Florida?).
|6.20.07 @ 6:46PM|#
Adjusting for their freeloading, Canada's average life
expectancy is far lower than it looks.
Canada is a welfare state funded by the US economy.
Canadian national defense is nonexistant without the US
military.
Canadian national healthcare is funded to an extraordinary percent
by US supplied R&D dollars, nevermind that the ability to pay
for care on this side of the border contributes artificially to its
lustre.
If people are needy enough, I'm not opposed to giving them unearned
money. I just wish they'd be more appreciative.
e|6.20.07 @ 7:14PM|#
"Adjusting for their freeloading, Canada's average life
expectancy is far lower than it looks. "
Adjusted for wasting time on Hit & Run, I am the most
productive and innovative American since Thomas Edison.
|6.20.07 @ 7:28PM|#
at any given time, how large a percentage of the Canadian
citizenry is actually in Florida?.
In winter, I'd bet there are 500,000 Canadians in the US at any
moment (not counting "frostbacks"= Canadian illegal
immigrants).
Actually, Quebecers and Maritimers head for Florida, Ontarions head
for Texas, & the Prairie People head for Arizona. BC people
head for Hawaii (to get drunk like the Premier).
Plus there is a very large contingent that heads on to Mexico.
SxCx|6.20.07 @ 9:37PM|#
Most embarrassing is the Canadian Radio and Television
Commission, better known as the CRTC. This is the bureaucratic
godhead that decides what passes as "Canadian content", feeling no
remorse in strangling the life out of things that don't fit its
pitifully narrow conception of what it means to live in this
country. As a result, most of our talent heads south, where it
doesn't matter if your script features a moose or Kensington Market
or the CFL, just as long as it can be interesting enough to entice
consumers.
Meanwhile the liberal arts intelligentsia hold more seminars
wondering why nobody wants to stick around and suffer, not even
stopping to consider how humiliating it is to beg your government
for an income.
P.S. I know this was unprovoked, but that's what happens after a
few glasses of Shiraz.
SxCx|6.20.07 @ 9:39PM|#
To be fair, it's actually the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission, as their strangling rights extend across all sorts of interactive boundaries.
SxCx|6.20.07 @ 9:43PM|#
Also, I can't help but find the slightly higher life expectancy
stats to be a bit of a red herring. A freer, less paternalistic and
regulated society will surely mean more people drinking, smoking,
and abusing themselves to an early grave. Not to say this is a bad
thing, being based on individual choice and all.
Likely not the entire picture, but worth keeping in mind.
|6.20.07 @ 10:14PM|#
We're going to a family reunion in Comox, BC next month. (My husband was an exchange student to Truro Nova Scotia in the 70's. He's a lot closer to his Canadian family than to his biological one.) I'll try to take the laptop and issue periodic reports. We were here for a week last August, and I must say it was lovely. This will be our first time to Vancouver Island, though. I'm totally excited about Fraser River fruit, fresh seafood, and it not being 105 degrees.
Gilbert Martn|6.20.07 @ 10:57PM|#
Of course higher average life expectancy comparisons, even if
they were between nations of comparable population levels and other
factors does not constitute proof of a superior system in the one
with the higher average.
Government policies produce mutlitple outcomes. The relative
valuation assigned to those outcomes - both positive and negative
-are a matter of personal opinion based on one's individual beliefs
- not a matter of empirical fact.
Since government has nothing to give to someone except that which
it has first taken away from someone else, the implicit assumption
behind touting longer life expectancies in Canada is that it is a
greater good to provide some people with medical treatment that
they could not obtain on their own by forcing other people to
subsidize them and be subjected to an inferior quality system than
one they could otherwise obtain on their own than the alternative
of leaving everyone to the outcome they could obtain on their own -
whatever that may be.
Freedom vs perceived security. It is not a fact that the latter is
a superior outcome to the former - it is merely a personal opinion
that it is.
|6.20.07 @ 11:52PM|#
Don't confuse the issue with facts, and anyway, statistics
have a well known liberal bias, and also we have a lot of lazy poor
people with bad hygene.
If that's how you read it, be my guest. That is not what I wrote.
But I really don't care what simpleminded fuckheads like you
think.
|6.21.07 @ 12:15AM|#
not counting "frostbacks"= Canadian illegal
immigrants
Yeah, but they're OK, coz they're white and talk almost like
they're Americans. And then all those Limeys, Scots and Micks ,
they're allright, too. Even if they talk funny.
There are actually an awful lot of the foregoing in FLA. But the
only people the locals seem to be concerned about are those fucking
greasers.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 1:26AM|#
Odd that anti-state libertarians are so enamored of the biggest, most powerful state on the planet. I guess you take your libertarianism with a large splash of old-fashioned my country-is-the-best, ass-kissing nationalism. Fucking flag wavers.
|6.21.07 @ 2:51AM|#
So their superheros closely mirror reality in relation to
America?
Sorry if somebody else said this first. I didn't want to read 160
posts.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 8:12AM|#
"Odd that anti-state libertarians are so enamored of the
biggest, most powerful state on the planet."
What's odd is that anyone would believe that libertarians would be
likely to accept the notion that a country with a bigger and more
paternalistic welfare state than the United States has is somehow
superior.
|6.21.07 @ 9:36AM|#
Edward - Sheesh, we libertarians sure are wacky! Especially
libertarians who are basically an updated version of the 18th
Century Liberals who wrote the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of
Rights.
I guess that if you stretch your credulity really far you can find
a contradiction in the idea that that a bunch of libertarians would
be "enamored" of the nation-state most responsible for defeating
authoritarianism during the Cold War and exporting the concept of
individual rights and the rule of law.
Flag waver... That's an insult where you come from, I assume. On
par with demeaning someone by calling them intelligent, healthy,
physically attractive and wealthy, right?
|6.21.07 @ 10:24AM|#
Superman is at least part Canadian. Joe Shuster was born in Toronto, and lived there until he was ten. He was one of the two creators of Superman.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 11:08AM|#
Rob
What our big, bloated militaristic nation-state spends "brigning
freedom and deomcracy" to Iraq dwarf's Canada's little
welfare-state expenditures.
|6.21.07 @ 11:12AM|#
# Gavin Peters | June 21, 2007, 10:24am | #
# Superman is at least part Canadian.
# Joe Shuster was born in Toronto, and
# lived there until he was ten. He was one
# of the two creators of Superman.
Also, in 1967, DC Comics (then called "National Periodical
Publications") celebrated the Montreal World's Fair by "giving"
Canada a Superman of its own. As I recall, Kal-El's brother (who
never existed in our reality) came to earth and became "Superman,"
taking the secret identity of "Ken Clarkson." "Our" Superman
eventually joined him, settling in Montreal and copying his
brother. Kal-El became "Hyperman" and got work as a reporter for
the Montreal Star.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 11:31AM|#
"What our big, bloated militaristic nation-state spends
"brigning freedom and deomcracy" to Iraq dwarf's Canada's little
welfare-state expenditures."
Uh Huh
And our total population and GDP dwarf Canada as well.
The revelant fact is that Canada exerts more conrol over it's own
citizens than the United States does by forcing them to participate
in and pay for more welfare state programs such as socialized
medicine.
That's not going to get an endorsement from people with libertarian
beliefs.
LarryA|6.21.07 @ 1:01PM|#
If you really want to annoy a Canadian, point out that even
though most Canadians define themselves in terms of "not being
American", they as a whole, in speech, dress and culture are more
like America than any other nation on earth.
Including the U.S.
Most of the Americans I know claim they're Canadian when they
go abroad. And when you're from Minneapolis (south Toronto) or
Seattle (south Vancouver), that's pretty easy to do.
I might consider that if I wasn't a Texan. My Wells Fargo credit
cards have stagecoaches on them. Works better than a maple
leaf.
Murders committed with handguns annually: United States 8,915,
Switzerland 53
1. Where are the U.S. murders committed? Most in cities with tough
gun laws and relatively low legal gun ownership. The high homicide
rate in the U.S. shouldn't be surprising, given that we're in the
midst of a civil war. (The War on Drugs.)
2. I noticed your statistics for handguns per household omit
Switzerland, where they are pretty common.
3. I also note your statistics omit the murder capital of the
world, Jaimaca, which prohibits all firearms ownership.
Odd that anti-state libertarians are so enamored of the
biggest, most powerful state on the planet. I guess you take your
libertarianism with a large splash of old-fashioned my
country-is-the-best, ass-kissing nationalism. Fucking flag
wavers.
Well, 1. The U.S. is relatively free and 2. One of a very few
countries which produces more in GDP than it consumes.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 1:06PM|#
Gilbert
So people with libertarian beliefs are ok with being forced to pay
for military adventures like invading Iraq? The Germans and the
French--mostly non-libertarian welfare-staters presumably--didn't
let their states participate in Bush's aggressive militaristic
spedning spree. Neither did the Canadians.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 1:09PM|#
The U.S. is relatively free...
Yeah, right.
Prisoners (per 1,000 people):
United States 4.2
United Kingdom 1.0
Germany 0.8
Denmark 0.7
Sweden 0.6
Japan 0.4
Netherlands 0.4
Death row inmates:
United States 2,124
Japan 38
Europe and Canada 0
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 1:30PM|#
"Gilbert
So people with libertarian beliefs are ok with being forced to pay
for military adventures like invading Iraq? The Germans and the
French--mostly non-libertarian welfare-staters presumably--didn't
let their states participate in Bush's aggressive militaristic
spedning spree. Neither did the Canadians."
You keep trying to highjack the thread into an argument about the
Iraq war - sorry but I'm not going to play along.
The point (again) is that United States citizens are MORE free from
government intereference in their lives than Canadians are.
Oh and US government spending for Social Security and Medicare fax
exceeds the total military budget - and has done so for
decades.
Furthermore, the top 50% of income earners pay 96% of the federal
income taxes. So there are a great many US citizens who are NOT
paying for the Iraq war - or much of anything else the US
government does.
And I will point out, again, that Germany, France and Canada would
not exist today as independent nations AT ALL - if they had not
been protected by the United States military for the last 60 years
and counting.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 1:32PM|#
"The U.S. is relatively free...
Yeah, right.
Prisoners (per 1,000 people):"
More irrelevant statistics.
Freedom has nothing to do with being able to commit crimes and not
get locked up for it.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 1:52PM|#
Gilbert,
Even victimless crimes like drug possession? Haven't our draconian
drug laws swelled the ranks of the un-free? C'mon, Gilb, you're
letting your raving, flag-waving nationalism derail your
libertarian principles.
|6.21.07 @ 1:57PM|#
Edward
If you want to discuss something actually posit something.
Quit with the fucking lists.
Yes your right about the war on drugs and it's eefect on prison
poulations. Most libertarians consider that axiomatic.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 2:37PM|#
Okay, Gilbert, I'll posit that American libertarians should be concerned with the ever growing power of their own militaristic state and forgo nationalistic pissing contests with weak little states like Canada.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 2:37PM|#
"Gilbert,
Even victimless crimes like drug possession? Haven't our draconian
drug laws swelled the ranks of the un-free? C'mon, Gilb, you're
letting your raving, flag-waving nationalism derail your
libertarian principles."
First, I never proclaimed myself to be a libertarian. I agree with
libertarian positions on some things becuase I believe they
actually correspond to the Constitution and what the founding
fathers intended and I disagree on other libertarian
positions.
Regardless, you keep throwing out things that have nothing to do
with the relative overall freedom level comparison between the
United States and Canada. The vast majority of Americans are not
incarcerated for drug charges or anything else.
100% of Canadians are required to participate in and pay for their
socialized medicine system whether they wish to do so or not.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 2:42PM|#
100% of Canadians are required to participate in and pay for
their socialized medicine system whether they wish to do so or
not.
But, Gilbert, 100% of us Americans are required to participate in
and pay for the invasion and occupation of Iraq whether we wish to
do so or not.
Which is worse?
Edward|6.21.07 @ 2:44PM|#
Gilbert,
So you're not as libertarian. Well that explains a lot. You're just
a garden-variety American national chauvinist. Does that make you a
troll here?
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 2:51PM|#
"Okay, Gilbert, I'll posit that American libertarians should be
concerned with the ever growing power of their own militaristic
state and forgo nationalistic pissing contests with weak little
states like Canada."
We don't have a miltaristic state - we have a welfaristic
state.
You either don't know - or willfully ignore what the federal
government is actually spending most of our tax money on. Spending
on various government handouts like Social Security, Medicare,
Medicaid, farm price supports education and housing subsidies, etc.
etc. etc. far exceed what is spent on the military each and every
year.
A government report by the Social Security and Medicare trustees
projects that those two programs alone will consume 50% of all
federal tax dollars by the year 2030 - in addition to the dedicated
payroll taxes that are going to them. The net present value of all
future Medicare liabilties on an accrual basis is up to about $75
TRILLION dollars and counting.
So you can save your anti-military rants for someone else. The
military wastes a lot of taxpayers money doing things inefficiently
and doing things that shouldn't be done.
But that isn't where the biggest government expense is. And unlike
the military every cent spent on those welfare programs is a
complete waste since none of those activities is pursuant to any
ennumerated power delegated to government by the Constitution to
begin with.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 2:54PM|#
"But, Gilbert, 100% of us Americans are required to participate
in and pay for the invasion and occupation of Iraq whether we wish
to do so or not."
Wrong - as I have already pointed out, the top 50% of income
earners pay 96% of the income taxes. The bottom 50% aren't paying
for much of anything the government does.
|6.21.07 @ 3:11PM|#
Okay, Gilbert, I'll posit that American libertarians should
be concerned with the ever growing power of their own militaristic
state and forgo nationalistic pissing contests with weak little
states like Canada.
I take that's intended for me.
When there's a thread on "the ever growing power of [our] own
militaristic state" we'll get right on it. Right now we're having a
little fun at the expense of Canadians and the superhroes.
Holy crap, lighten up and grow a sense of humor.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 3:30PM|#
Point taken Isaac. Sometimes I get carried away. Ever hear why Canadians think American beer is like making love in a canoe? It's fucking close to water. Of course, Canadian beer is probably heavily taxed to pay for socialized detox programs.
|6.21.07 @ 3:45PM|#
Edward
Thanksgiving is the day when Americans thank God they're Americans,
and Canadians thank God they're not.
A little girl on a train crossing the border in to Canada is
overheard to say, "Goodbye, God, I'm going to Canada."
A Canadian passenger outraged by this chauvinism says to his
companion, "well, I never, that little girl thinks God only loks
after people in the States."
His companion replies, "No, that's not it at all. I distinctly
heard her say, 'Good, by God! I'm going to
Canada'."
|6.21.07 @ 4:24PM|#
"Rob - What our big, bloated militaristic nation-state spends
'brigning freedom and deomcracy' to Iraq dwarf's Canada's little
welfare-state expenditures."
1) How do you get from what I said, which was "the nation-state
most responsible for defeating authoritarianism during the Cold War
and exporting the concept of individual rights and the rule of law"
to some crap about Iraq?
2) Do you believe that Iraq expenditures actually are greater, as a
percentage of the U.S. GDP, than the percentage of GDP Canada
spends on socialized health care? Because if that's what you're
claiming, you're just plain wrong. Here's the math: Canada's total
health care expenditures as a percentage of GDP grew to an
estimated 10.4% in 2005. U.S. DoD accounts for about 3.7 percent of
GDP. Which includes your nonsense about Iraq funding...
3) Do you think I was referring to Iraq, because I was mostly
thinking of the Marshall Plan. But hey, that was a bunch of
programs designed to hand out stuff and make life better for our
recently defeated enemies as well as our allies, and in principle
libertarians might look askance at that. I think it was a genius
strategy, in retrospect, based on the current state of world
affairs.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 4:31PM|#
"How do you get from what I said, which was "the nation-state
most responsible for defeating authoritarianism during the Cold War
and exporting the concept of individual rights and the rule of law"
to some crap about Iraq?"
He gets to it because all he really wants to do is carp about the
Iraq war and just about anything that's said by anybody is used as
another opening to do just that.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 4:32PM|#
Rob,
"...programs designed to hand out stuff and make life better for
our recently defeated enemies as well as our allies, and in
principle libertarians might look askance at that. I think it was a
genius strategy, in retrospect, based on the current state of world
affairs"
Yeah, I should think libertarians would look asaknce at that. I'm
amazed you don't. You support giving tax-payer handouts to
foreigners we've defeated and at the same time oppose giving
tax-payer subsidies to American citizens with no healthcare
coverage? Amazing.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 4:35PM|#
Gibert,
Taxes--don't you just hate them?-- are funding the war, you know.
I'll bet you thought Cheney was paying for it out of his own
pocket. With Cheney, the pocket thing goes the other way.
|6.21.07 @ 4:40PM|#
Godammit, guys, I just got him calmed down and you guys had to
go and poke him and get him all riled up again.
Fucking kids!!
Edward|6.21.07 @ 4:40PM|#
Isaac:
Canada Apologises To The US
A truly Canadian Apology to the USA, courtesy of Rick Mercer from
This Hour Has 22 Minutes, CBC Television:
Hello. I'm Anthony St. George on location here in Washington.
On behalf of Canadians everywhere I'd like to offer an apology to
the United States of America. We haven't been getting along very
well recently and for that, I am truly sorry. I'm sorry we called
George Bush a moron. He is a moron, but it wasn't nice of us to
point it out. If it's any consolation, the fact that he's a moron
shouldn't reflect poorly on the people of America. After all, it's
not like you actually elected him.
I'm sorry about our softwood lumber. Just because we have more
trees than you, doesn't give us the right to sell you lumber that's
cheaper and better than your own. It would be like if, well, say
you had ten times the television audience we did and you flood our
market with great shows, cheaper than we could produce. I know
you'd never do that.
I'm sorry we beat you in Olympic hockey. In our defense I guess our
excuse would be that our team was much, much, much, much better
than yours. As word of apology, please accept all of our NHL teams
which, one by one, are going out of business and moving to your
fine country.
I'm sorry about our waffling on Iraq. I mean, when you're going up
against a crazed dictator, you want to have your friends by your
side. I realize it took more than two years before you guys pitched
in against Hitler, but that was different. Everyone knew he had
weapons.
I'm sorry we burnt down your White House during the War of 1812. I
see you've rebuilt it! It's very nice.
I'm sorry for Alan Thicke, Shania Twain, Celine Dion, Loverboy,
that song from Seriff that ends with a really high-pitched long
note. Your beer. I know we had nothing to do with your beer, but we
feel your pain.
And finally on behalf of all Canadians, I'm sorry that we're
constantly apologizing for things in a passive-aggressive way which
is really a thinly veiled criticism. I sincerely hope that you're
not upset over this. Because we've seen what you do to countries
you get upset with.
For 22 minutes, I'm Anthony St. George, and I'm sorry.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|6.21.07 @ 4:44PM|#
Ok, back to fan-boy thread... Who do you think would win, Captain America or Wolverine? My money is on Cap, even though Wolverine is a bad motha- you know who I'm talking about...
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 4:48PM|#
"Godammit, guys, I just got him calmed down and you guys had to
go and poke him and get him all riled up again."
Well it's too much fun making him look like an idiot - not that
that requires a whole lot of work.
|6.21.07 @ 5:20PM|#
"Yeah, I should think libertarians would look asaknce at that.
I'm amazed you don't."
That's the benefit of 20/20 hindsight. If something worked
amazingly well, you can admit it if you aren't crazed to the point
of intellectual blindness by your ideology.
"You support giving tax-payer handouts to foreigners we've defeated
and at the same time oppose giving tax-payer subsidies to American
citizens with no healthcare coverage? Amazing."
It's really not that big of a leap. The Marshall Plan provided the
framework for the most sensible, systematic approach to
international relations the world has ever known, based on sound
economic and foreign policy goals. Socialized medicine is an
amazingly bad way to distribute limited goods and services that a
free market is much better at.
Put another way...
The Marshall Plan helped the U.S. avoid World War 3, which is good
for both our nation and the rest of the world.
Socialized medicine is a Ponzi scheme that would carry the U.S.
toward financial ruin that would hurt the rest of the world (by
weakening the positive, collaborative effect the U.S. brings to the
table and the corresponding increase in individual liberty,
prosperity and respect for the rule of law that accompanies
it).
I think you're basically feigning your incredulity, the way most
people who can't understand someone who is either both pro-choice
and anti-death penalty or pro-life and pro-death penalty. There's
not really a contradiction in those positions (and they often
correlate), but people who are incapable of comprehending things
with any sense of nuance love to pretend there's a contradiction so
that they can grind their personal ideological axe.
Gilbert Martin|6.21.07 @ 5:42PM|#
"The Marshall Plan helped the U.S. avoid World War 3, which is
good for both our nation and the rest of the world."
Yes and unlike socialized medicine schemes, it was not an open
ended program that was intended to go on forever.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 6:29PM|#
Go on forever?!! Eternal socialized medicine! Now you have me really scared, Gib. A nuclear holocaust and global warming are nothing comapared to this.
Edward|6.21.07 @ 6:39PM|#
A must read for chuckleheads:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0223-01.htm
Published on Monday, February 23, 2004 by the Los Angeles
Times
In Health, Canada Tops US
Our neighbors to the north live longer and pay less for care. The
reasons why are being debated, but some cite the gap between rich
and poor in the US
by Judy Foreman
Site comments/questions:
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(310) 367-6109
Editorial & Production Offices:
3415 S. Sepulveda Blvd.
Suite 400
Los Angeles, CA 90034
(310) 391-2245