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Rudy: No on Medical Marijuana
Just finished my reporting trip with a Rudy Giuliani town hall in New Castle, New Hampshire, a tiny island luxuryville a few miles from Portsmouth. Don Murphy from Republicans for Compassionate Access, the pro-medical marijuana group, got to ask Rudy a quick question in the mass flesh-press that preceded him leaving the event. Rough transcription:
MURPHY: You talked about abortion rights and how you trust
people to make their own choices. Do you support the choice of
cancer patients to use medical marijuana?
RUDY: No, I don't think a cancer patient should use marijuana.
There are other options.
Coming after a lot of flights of "the government can't tell you what to do!" rhetoric, it was pretty abrupt.
(Oh, this isn't on video as I was busy a couple of steps away. Besides, YouTube stopped payment on my bribe. But Murphy audiotaped it.)
|6.6.07 @ 12:08PM|#
Remember,
according to Rudy:
"Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you do."
People who are so ill that they can't keep their food down are free
to vomit in their toilets. According to Rudy, that's all the
freedom they need. ;)
|6.6.07 @ 12:08PM|#
right Rudy, the other options are expensive corporate pain killers that cause addiction as opposed to a natural pain killer with no proven addictive properties.
|6.6.07 @ 12:09PM|#
"Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to
cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you
do."
i think i just threw up a little because of that statement.
|6.6.07 @ 12:10PM|#
With cancer and medical marijuana, "Live Free or Die" takes on a whole new urgency, no?
|6.6.07 @ 12:17PM|#
RUDY: No, I don't think a cancer patient should use
marijuana. There are other options.
Other options!? "Hey, whatever benefit marijuana provides dying
people, they should exercise the option of suffering instead." What
a douche!
Of course what he really means is "Marijuana is too cheap and easy
to obtain. You can't have it until a big pharmaceutical is able to
put a huge markup on it, and then only after you get a prescription
from one of our minions a licensed physician.
|6.6.07 @ 12:22PM|#
"Remember, according to Rudy: 'Freedom is about the willingness
of every single human being to cede to lawful authority a great
deal of discretion about what you do.'"
Thus, logically, serfdom is about the unwillingness of some to cede
to authority the right to take away our discretion to do what we
damn well please if we're not harming others.
OMG, libertarians are anti-liberty!
Orwell's Ministry of Truth would be pleased by Rudy's comment.
|6.6.07 @ 12:34PM|#
MURPHY: You talked about abortion rights and how you trust
people to make their own choices. Do you support the choice of
cancer patients to use medical marijuana?
RUDY: No, I don't think a cancer patient should use marijuana.
There are other options.
Why didn't they ask why this option should be off the table,
especially if it works?
|6.6.07 @ 12:36PM|#
One can only hope that Rudy is given cause to sample those other
options himself, and soon.
What a hideous piece of fascist shit he is.
Bhh|6.6.07 @ 12:43PM|#
There was a lot of talk about that Rudy quote and the basic idea
can be traced back to Hegel. In other words, our leaders are
following 18th century Prussians rather than Locke, Smith,
Jefferson and dem. Awesome.
Maybe one of the (spits) Kristols hipped him to that. Without
investigating it, I imagine the neocons are responsible for
injecting authoritarian kraut ideas into the mainstream of the
US.
|6.6.07 @ 12:44PM|#
Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being
to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what
you do.
*falls off of chair*
*vomits*
*chokes to death*
|6.6.07 @ 12:49PM|#
Why didn't they ask why this option should be off the table,
especially if it works?
Unless you're either 1)really pushy or 2)a giant, you don't really
get a chance to follow up at these things. There was a huge mob
around Rudy, lots of people firing questions, and for Don to ask a
follow-up he would have had to shout them down and wrestle to keep
his place near Rudy. He didn't.
|6.6.07 @ 1:04PM|#
New Castle?! Why not have a town hall meeting on the Isles of Shoals. That would keep those pesky 9/11 truthers from pestering your campaign people.
Jennifer|6.6.07 @ 1:55PM|#
Eric Dondero is way overdue to show up and start posting about how Giuliani is a great freedom-defending libertarian.
Rhywun|6.6.07 @ 2:04PM|#
Geez. That quote again?! I'm no big fan of Rudy but isn't it pretty clear that he was basically referring to the rule of law? We might quibble about what the phrase "what you do" is referring to, as I'm sure Rudy would apply it to many more things than you or I would; but otherwise the quote is pretty much a description of the current state of law enforcement.
robc|6.6.07 @ 2:14PM|#
Rhywun,
I dont think the phrase "a great deal" fits the rule of law. If he
had said "a tiny amount of descretion" some of us would be okay
with it. Others still wouldnt.
Lupito41|6.6.07 @ 2:26PM|#
"That quote again?!"
This quote should be far more familiar to Joe Voter than "...did
vote for the 87 billion before I voted against it.", "I didn't
inhale.", or "Read my lips."
I say don't stop until it is. If only we could fit it on a
bumper-sticker...
|6.6.07 @ 2:33PM|#
the quote is pretty much a description of the current state
of law enforcement.
Which makes it all the more sad/disgusting.
I'm sure Rudy would apply it to many more things than you or I
would
Which is kind of our whole problem with Rudy in a nutshell - he
would apply state control to many more things than you or I would.
This is not a trivial semantic issue - this is the core of
political philosophy.
Rick H.|6.6.07 @ 2:41PM|#
Disappointing.
TallDave: I can't imagine what in Rudy's political history led you
to expect more than bald authoritarian scumbaggery. Please
enlighten me.
|6.6.07 @ 3:05PM|#
Unless you're either 1)really pushy or 2)a giant, you don't
really get a chance to follow up at these things. There was a huge
mob around Rudy, lots of people firing questions, and for Don to
ask a follow-up he would have had to shout them down and wrestle to
keep his place near Rudy. He didn't.
I kind of figured that they'd never get the chance. I didn't mean
for my post to sound critical of Murphy.
It's just that "there are other options" is exactly the sort of
bullshit soundbite answer we always get from politicians. They nevr
bother to address what those options are or why this one is
unacceptable.
Eric Dondero|6.6.07 @ 3:06PM|#
Don is a good guy. But it should be noted that he's a diehard
John McCain partisan.
At the RLC National Convention last September he was the most
outspoken delegate for McCain. He was also quite critical of Rudy
on all accounts.
I like Don. He's a fantastic libertarian Republican. But let's keep
this in context.
Someone should ask Don how his hero McCain stands on legalized
marijuana?
|6.6.07 @ 3:16PM|#
So Rudy doesn't think people suffering from cancer should use marijuana. Why the hell not if it relieves their suffering. I am so sick of politicians preaching to others. Actually I don't believe he really believes what he said--but he thought it was what the majority wanted to hear.
LarryA|6.6.07 @ 3:19PM|#
Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being
to cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what
you do.
Freedom is about lawful authority leaving me the hell alone until I
infringe on someone else's freedom.
Responsibility is conducting my life so lawful authority doesn't
have to intervene.
Jennifer|6.6.07 @ 3:42PM|#
Someone should ask Don how his hero McCain stands on
legalized marijuana?
Who cares? What matters is, your libertarian hero Giuliani thinks
sick people who smoke pot should be viewed as criminals.
By the way, Eric: since you're a better libertarian than anybody
here, could you tell me which plank of the libertarian platform
boils down to 'freedom means giving authority figures discretion
over what you do'? Since your hero Giuliani said it, I figure it
must be a core libertarian philosophy: the freedom to do as you're
told.
Maybe he meant it in a masochistic S&M slave/dom sort of
way.
|6.6.07 @ 3:44PM|#
"Geez. That quote again?! I'm no big fan of Rudy but isn't it
pretty clear that he was basically referring to the rule of law? We
might quibble about what the phrase "what you do" is referring to,
as I'm sure Rudy would apply it to many more things than you or I
would; but otherwise the quote is pretty much a description of the
current state of law enforcement."
Yeah, and the people who post here are soooooo happy about the
current state of law enforcement, much less the enhanced state of
enforcement Guiliani would like to implement.
TallDave|6.6.07 @ 4:12PM|#
'Freedom is about the willingness of every single human being to
cede to lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you
do.'
I think Rudy was mostly talking about not wiping a dirty rag on
someone windshield and demanding they pay you for it.
Stilll, this is very disappointing. Hopefully, if he wins the
nomination, he'll tack more centrist. He did seem to be channelling
Arnold Kling on health care.
TallDave|6.6.07 @ 4:14PM|#
I'd like to see him apply the same logic he did on abortion -- he can think it's wrong, but the State doesn't need to lock people up for making a different decision than he does.
|6.6.07 @ 6:29PM|#
By the way, Eric: since you're a better libertarian than
anybody here, could you tell me which plank of the libertarian
platform boils down to 'freedom means giving authority figures
discretion over what you do'? Since your hero Giuliani said it, I
figure it must be a core libertarian philosophy: the freedom to do
as you're told.
(Crickets chirping....)
Kevin|6.6.07 @ 8:15PM|#
Someone should ask Don how his hero McCain stands on legalized marijuana?
Eric, this is not about how McLame stands on pot, this is about
Giuliani.
Please tell me how Giuliani appeals to libertarians again?
|6.6.07 @ 10:48PM|#
Libertarians for Guiliani:
Pornographers for Chastity;
Smackheads for Sobriety;
Ministry of Truth.
Orwell would be proud, Dondero.
|6.6.07 @ 11:59PM|#
Abortion: It's a woman's right to choose
Marijuana: No way
This alone shows Giuliani isn't a libertarian for two
reasons:
1. Anti-marijuana (for medicine no less)
2. The answer to the question why is "because I say so"
|6.7.07 @ 12:55AM|#
Rudi,should and is showing us that he totally ignorant of the facts. However, I hope he keeps repeating this statement because it's makes Obama look more intelligent and we the American people are sick of the same old, and and I do mean old GOP for Grand OLD party!!!
|6.7.07 @ 10:32AM|#
"Someone should ask Don how his hero McCain stands on legalized
marijuana?"
McCain was asked if he would end the federal raids on medical
marijuana patients in the states that allow its use. He said that
he'd let states decide the issue. Not as supportive as I'd like,
but much, much better than, "there are other options."
|6.7.07 @ 1:02PM|#
Don is a good guy. But it should be noted that he's a diehard
John McCain partisan.
At the RLC National Convention last September he was the most
outspoken delegate for McCain. He was also quite critical of Rudy
on all accounts.
I like Don. He's a fantastic libertarian Republican. But let's keep
this in context.
Someone should ask Don how his hero McCain stands on legalized
marijuana?
Yes, Eric is correct, I am a huge McCain Fan... His service to our
country is inspiring and in fact worthy of 'hero' status. I was a
big supporter in 2000. I believe I was right then and am right
now.
As is pointed out above by Granite Stater, McCain's position is
consistent with GOP principles.
At the RLC Convention, nearly 9 months ago, my critism was directed
only at how the Mayor's liberal positions would hurt his chances of
winning the primary. I will be critical now of what appears to be a
very inconsistent position on medical marijuana. For someone who
supports 'choice' at the beginning of life to not support 'choice'
at end of life, makes no sense.
|6.7.07 @ 1:49PM|#
Wow, Dondero crawled out from under his rock
emerged from the Red Libertarians Clubhouse to drop a remark and
run.
J|6.7.07 @ 3:31PM|#
first off as sad as it is to admit, there is too much money in keeping marajuana illegal than there could ever be in legalizing it... cops are asshole as mpp has made obvious and fines for marajunana keep goin up... what we need is a president who understands the benefits of this wonderful herb being legalized and unfortunately rudy, although a great leader and canidate, is not that guy...
stuart cooper|6.11.07 @ 5:29PM|#
IF YOU WANT TO LEARN WHERE ALL OF THE CANDIDATES STAND ON MEDICAL MARIJUANA PLEASE VISIT: WWW.GRANITESTATERS.COM
Matt Simon|6.11.07 @ 9:24PM|#
If you want to help end Marijuana Prohibition, visit RescheduleCannabis.org/
joe riley|6.12.07 @ 5:49PM|#
what's really frightening is that hillary and giuliani are in the lead, giuliani will harm the medical marijuana movement and all that we've worked for. i really pray pray pray this insensitive imbicile is NOT elected.
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