Reason.com
New at Reason
Marty Beckerman can tell a racist joke, and he can laugh at a racist joke. So why isn't Don Imus funny?
Most Popular Stories
- 5 Classic Teen Sex-and-Drug Freakouts: Rainbow Parties, Butt-Chugging, And So Much More (By Which We Mean Less) (5.27)
- Government Beneficiaries and Other Fairy Tales (5.26)
- Are We Headed for a Fight with China? (5.28)
- Lessons From the United Fruit Company (5.28)
- Do Organic Consumers Shop Exclusively at the Jerk Store? (5.26)
Reason RUPE: Public Opinion Survey
- Reason-Rupe: Wisconsinites Favor Increasing Public Union Retirement Contributions to Address Budget Deficit (5.25)
- Reason-Rupe Poll Finds Support for Public Union Reforms (5.25)
- New Poll: Obama Leads Romney In Wisconsin, But Gary Johnson Could Impact the Race (5.24)
- Wisconsin Recall: Walker Leads Barrett 50-42 Among Likely Voters (5.24)
- Reason-Rupe Poll: Walker Leads Barrett 50-42, Obama Leads Romney 46-36 (5.24)
advertisements
Reason on Facebook
Reason on Twitter
Reason on YouTube
Reason RSSGet Reason E-mail Updates!
Manage your Reason e-mail list subscriptionsSite comments/questions:
Media Inquiries and Reprint Permissions:
(310) 367-6109
Editorial & Production Offices:
3415 S. Sepulveda Blvd.
Suite 400
Los Angeles, CA 90034
(310) 391-2245
Editor's Note: We invite comments and request that they be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of Reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment or disable your ability to comment for any reason at any time.
shecky|4.10.07 @ 3:54PM|#
As usual, it's all in the delivery.
|4.10.07 @ 4:02PM|#
Great article.
Kap|4.10.07 @ 4:04PM|#
Also, Dude, midget is not the preferred nomenclature...
|4.10.07 @ 4:05PM|#
So why isn't Don Imus funny?
Genetics?
lunchstealer|4.10.07 @ 4:06PM|#
See, if he'd just suffixed it with
he'd have transitioned from offensive racial stereotype hurtful to blacks, to offensive unfunny repeating of an unfunny meme, offensive to all people. This is far more generally forgivable, since there are larger offensively unfunny fish to fry out there. Hell, we haven't even gotten Carrot Top into that unfunny fat fryer yet.
VM|4.10.07 @ 4:06PM|#
agreed, ^#. agreed.
*passes him a demon dog.
steve|4.10.07 @ 4:07PM|#
What a ridiculous comparison. When we laugh at racist jokes made by Eric Cartman, we're laughing at Eric Cartman. When Ann Coulter called someone a faggot, when Trent Lott longed aloud for the days of segregation, and when Don Imus called the Rutgers basketball team a bunch of nappy-headed hos, they're exactly the people that Eric Cartman, and Homer Simpson and Archie Bunker before him, are intended to make fun of. Ever heard of satire? Or were you one of the people walking around in the early 90s with "Bart Simpson- Underachiever and Proud of it" shirts?
As full disclosure, I haven't been caught up in the "outrage" over Imus's remarks. I looked at it as one more example of the growing cultural vacuum that is modern media. But your attempt to argue that "Cartman gets away with it" so we should lighten up when Imus sticks his foot in his mouth is completely absurd.
Cesar|4.10.07 @ 4:10PM|#
What Imus said was pretty disgusting and theres no way to defend it, but Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson can piss off. They have their own histories of saying offensive things--"hymietown" anyone?
|4.10.07 @ 4:10PM|#
I agree with Shecky. A good racist joke has to be delivered very tongue-in-cheek, with no hint of meanspiritedness and even a bit of giddiness. It also has to be clearly funny and not take much thought to get the humor.
Imus's delivery was meanspirited and the joke wasn't terribly funny, and required some thought to get.
lunchstealer|4.10.07 @ 4:11PM|#
Ah, the nurture vs nature debate on the causes of unfunniness. An eternal question.
|4.10.07 @ 4:14PM|#
Right, Imus and Coulter and Richards weren't making fun of people who use (or think in) those slurs. They weren't talking about the foibles of people trying to navigate around pitfalls.
They were calling people niggers, faggots and hos. And that's it. The butt of the joke wasn't the racist, or the confused guy, or themselves, or the people dealing with the fallout. The butt of these jokes were black people, a man deemed insufficiently masculine, and a dozen black woman athletes. And the only thing any of them did that was supposed to be humorous was to belong to the group described by the slurs.
|4.10.07 @ 4:14PM|#
steve,
With whom are you arguing?
|4.10.07 @ 4:16PM|#
The last remaining comedic brain cell in Don Imus' head was killed by a double line of cocaine back in 1978. It's been almost 30 years since Imus was funny.
|4.10.07 @ 4:17PM|#
I think part of it is who Imus was attacking. He said some really rotten things about a bunch of college athletes. Who did they bother? What did they do to deserve being called nappy headed hos? To the extent that a racist joke can be funny, it can only be funny to the extent that it takes down parts of a community or traits that are worthy of scorn; think Richard Pryor making fun of an uptight white guy, Chris Rock making fun of some thug hoodrat. There is nothing worthy of scorn about the Rutgers women's basketball team. So, Imus just comes accross as an unfunny jerk.
|4.10.07 @ 4:20PM|#
Cesar,
What Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton did was offensive, but National Review can piss off. It has its own history of supporting racial segregation - "right now, the white race is the superior race" anyone?
Now this is the part where you denounce National Review, and think up a liberal figure who's done something racially insensitive. How far from Don Imus do you think we can change the subject?
Cesar|4.10.07 @ 4:20PM|#
John hit the nail on the head. These girls if anything are worthy of peoples respect. They are extremely talented student-athletes, most of whom are probably first generation college students.
D.A. Ridgely|4.10.07 @ 4:21PM|#
We essentially empower or give comedians permission to say things "on stage" even they could not get away with saying as private individuals. Not that he seemed to have much talent as a stand-up to begin with, but it was obvious from the Richards video that he was no longer "on" but had lost it emotionally and was merely reacting, having lost control of the audience.
Even then, how the audience might react to a racial joke can be risky. Sarah Silverman, doing a bit about avoiding jury duty, said (not verbatim) "A friend said put something racist in the juror questionnaire and they won't take you, so first I wrote "I hate chinks," But that sounded mean, so I erased it and wrote "I love chinks.""
She caught some flak for that and responded beautifully. (Again, not verbatim) "I got criticized for using the word "chink" and, speaking as a Jew, I just want to say that I find it deeply disturbing that we may be losing control of the media."
Now, that's funny.
Cesar|4.10.07 @ 4:22PM|#
Joe-
I don't see anyone from the National Review milking this incident for all its worth get more TV time.
|4.10.07 @ 4:28PM|#
"On the other hand many bigots utilize shock humor as a means of clarifying and reinforcing group solidarity; spend a few minutes with the average clique of College Republicans and you'll hear black babies compared to bowel movements and AIDS praised as God's cure for homosexuality. As one GOP devotee at American University told me, "You shouldn't go to jail for dragging gay people from your truck because it's not like they're human anyway." (Ha! Ha! Good one, old sport!) Senator Trent Lott and former Rep. John Cooksey, who defended the racial profiling of anyone who wears a "diaper on his head," have made similarly jaw-dropping gaffes in attempts at jest."
Marty Beckerman has obviously never been around a bunch of blue-collar (Democratic voting) union guys bitching about the niggers and wetbacks that are taking their jobs. Bigotry is not party specific. Except in joe's world.
|4.10.07 @ 4:29PM|#
All right Joe, please link to when national review said that and provide the context for when it was said.
steve|4.10.07 @ 4:33PM|#
highnumber,
I was addressing the writer of the article. Sorry, should have been more specific.
|4.10.07 @ 4:36PM|#
Once again, a Reason author forces me to side with the Republicans. Beckerman says "spend a few minutes with the average clique of College Republicans and you'll hear black babies compared to bowel movements...". Huh? I don't know what colleges he's hanging out in, but they're none of the ones I've hung out in. I've no doubt that some people on campus are behaving that way, but I think he's mistaking drunken fraternities for a political movement. Republicans as bigots is a weary stereotype that should have died decades ago. I'm saddened that Reason cannot get past puerile name calling.
lunchstealer|4.10.07 @ 4:36PM|#
I don't see anyone from the National Review milking this incident for all its worth get more TV time.
No, but they've certainly gotten mileage out of Jackson & Sharpton's transgressions in the past, so the comparison isn't wholly inappropriate.
The question really should be, have NR, Sharpton, or Jackson changed their ways? The hypocrisy is not necessarily in denouncing a transgression that you have made in the past, but denouncing a transgression that you would make now. For an institution like NR, where relatively few of the staff remain from the days in which they were defending segregation four decades ago, it's not such a stretch. For Sharpton and Jackson, whose antisemitic remarks date only from the early '90s, it's worth a raised eyebrow. But frankly, regardless of their own past transgressions, Imus was a stupid dick, and they're within their rights to call him on it.
Just as they should be called on it if they're ever stupid dicks again themselves.
|4.10.07 @ 4:39PM|#
steve,
I still have no idea where you're coming from.
You read this:
and you responded with this:
Explain your conclusion, please.
|4.10.07 @ 4:40PM|#
David Johnson,
Beckerman seems to be just as big of a moron as Imus. I have never heard anyone say anything that stupid. I think he made it up. I am frankly surprised it got by Reason's editors. The fact that it did and no one at Reason asked Beckerman for some proof of his claim makes me really wonder about the quality of its editors. Who were these people that Beckerman alledgedly talked to? When? Where are they now? Were there any witnesses?
|4.10.07 @ 4:41PM|#
So why isn't Don Imus funny?
Man, if you have to ask, you'll never know.
|4.10.07 @ 4:42PM|#
Mr. Beckerman wrote, "Spend a few minutes with the average clique of College Republicans and you'll hear black babies compared to bowel movements and AIDS praised as God's cure for homosexuality."
I've known many College Republicans and have never heard anything of the kind. And I don't think I've ever heard anyone, College Republican or not, compare black babies to bowel movements.
SugarFree|4.10.07 @ 4:46PM|#
I don't think the Imus controversy has anything to do with his racist remarks, but rather the fact that he was attacking that sacred cow of liberal media... women's basketball. It receives 5 times the coverage the actual interest in it warrants.
The highest attendance WNBA teams usually can't even filled a moderately-sized arena, yet the Today Show, et al yammers on and on.
There are plenty of sports I'll pay to see women play; basketball is not one of them.
|4.10.07 @ 4:46PM|#
I think Beckerman and Reason owe an explanation for that statement. That is Daily Kos garbage. Isn't Reason supposed to be a serious magazine? No serious magazine would print that. What the hell is going on?
Asharak|4.10.07 @ 4:47PM|#
What Imus said was pretty disgusting and theres no way to defend it, but Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson can piss off. They have their own histories of saying offensive things--"hymietown" anyone?
Agreed, not to mention that Jackson was one of the earliest supporters of the War on Drugs, which has put a whole lot of young black men in jail. It's double hypocrisy on his part.
Reason 2006|4.10.07 @ 5:02PM|#
John and James,
With the Republicans in control of both houses of Congress, it's the duty of all principled libertarians to unquestioningly adopt all the positions and rhetoric of the party out of power. If the Democrats had any voice at all in our government or media, we'd be parroting Republican talking points instead.
As ever,
|4.10.07 @ 5:03PM|#
I'm glad I'm not the only one who drew a blank re: black babies and bowel movements. There is an incident I seem to remember hearing about maybe back in the Reagan years that sounds similar, but I'll be damned if I can find the info. I'm quite certain that it would take more more than "a few minutes with the average clique of College Republicans" before I'd hear something so reprehensible.
|4.10.07 @ 5:09PM|#
What's wrong with "nappy"? Are Sharpton et al. ashamed of nappy hair? And as for calling women "hos", isn't that part of the everyday male lexicon in certain neighborhoods?
Are are these words like the "n-word", that has been "reclaimed" by some blacks, while whites are not allowed to use it?
shecky|4.10.07 @ 5:12PM|#
Black babies = bowel movements? Never heard that one.
Black babies = niglets? Yeah, that's the one I remember.
It should be noted these were generic college conservatives, not College Republicans.
Marty B.|4.10.07 @ 5:13PM|#
Hey guys, I've asked reason to change that line to "certain cliques"; it was over the top and obviously only a fringe of young Republicans truly qualify as racists. I'd hate for people to miss the point of the column over a throwaway insult that was funny at 3 a.m., so I've asked for the change before this molehill becomes a mountain.
Good Lord, this must be how Imus feels(!!!!!) What was I saying about Jesus again?
|4.10.07 @ 5:14PM|#
I'm glad I'm not the only one who drew a blank re: black babies and bowel movements.
Is it an oblique reference to the euphemism "giving birth to a brown baby"? If so, what does it have to do with College Republicans? Isn't it something Cartman said?
Asharak|4.10.07 @ 5:16PM|#
Reason 2006 | April 10, 2007, 5:02pm | #
John and James,
With the Republicans in control of both houses of Congress, it's the duty of all principled libertarians to unquestioningly adopt all the positions and rhetoric of the party out of power. If the Democrats had any voice at all in our government or media, we'd be parroting Republican talking points instead.
As ever,
The Republicans are in control of both houses of Congress?
If you're gonna build a strawman, you could at least do it right.
_______|4.10.07 @ 5:18PM|#
"I have to drop the Cosby kids off at the pool"
that is the "joke" you guys are looking for
|4.10.07 @ 5:21PM|#
spend a few minutes with the average clique of College Republicans and you'll hear black babies compared to bowel movements...
I spent my college years with a bunch of drunken country-club halfwits at a school in Richmond VA, twenty years ago and never heard anything to compare to that.
I call shenanigans.
Cesar|4.10.07 @ 5:23PM|#
R C Dean-
*I spent my college years with a bunch of drunken country-club halfwits at a school in Richmond VA, twenty years ago and never heard anything to compare to that.*
Did you to go U of R, by any chance?
|4.10.07 @ 5:28PM|#
Seems to me the problem is not "Imus is a racist" but rather "Imus isn't funny".
VM|4.10.07 @ 5:29PM|#
check out Marty's other work - on his web site!
:)
edna|4.10.07 @ 5:30PM|#
i can't believe that no-one has quoted the jesse jackson line from the south park "nigger" episode.
for shame, for shame. all of you!
|4.10.07 @ 5:34PM|#
Isn't Reason supposed to be a serious magazine?
This sounds to me like a form of "For a site called Reason..."
Judges?
VM|4.10.07 @ 5:39PM|#
Psssccchhhhhtttttt.
glug glug glug glug glug
ssss sssssssss
sip sip.
mmmmmmmmmm.
[now that's a tasty brew]
|4.10.07 @ 5:43PM|#
Overall, great article. When I was in school, me and a couple of my Jewish friends used to banter back and forth and make racist jokes about each other*, but it was obviously in good fun. Another guy in our fraternity would occasionally make comments too and it would piss them off. It wasn't the comment itself that pissed them off, but that my friend sense "I think deep down inside, he really believes that stuff. With you I know it's a joke."
That's the problem with Richards, Imus and Coulter. It wasn't even that they weren't funny (that's part of it), but that you could tell they were expressing true feelings. Heck, I'm sure Chris Rock or Dave Chappelle have bombed many a time with an unfunny racist joke, but they weren't called racist for it because it was still apparent that they were trying to tell a joke but failed.
Will Allen may accuse me of mind reading, but you can often tell by context and how they said things and how they react after getting called out what their intentions were. Compare Silverman's reaction in the comment above with Imus'. Silverman brushed it off with another joke, Imus went on a nationwide tour (methinks Imus doth protest too much).
* They'd call me a camel jockey or terrorist, I'd tell them to finish building my pyramid or make some comment on their thriftiness, etc.
D.A. Ridgely|4.10.07 @ 5:50PM|#
women's basketball... receives 5 times the coverage the actual interest in it warrants
5 * 0 > 0?
I say the time has come for NCAA Roller Derby!
|4.10.07 @ 5:53PM|#
I call shenanigans on SugarFree's comment re: women's hoops. While I'm not a fan, women's college hoops is a big draw and makes a grip of dough. The Final Four alone brought in $25 million in revenue to Cleveland. The Tennessee-UNC game had a 2.2 Neilsen rating compared to the Dallas-Phoenix game's 3.0 rating despite the former being on cable, competing with opening day and the later being the premier weekend pro game on broadcast TV.
|4.10.07 @ 5:58PM|#
I watched Imus once. I t reminded me of better days.
and LEMMON/714
Paul|4.10.07 @ 6:11PM|#
- "right now, the white race is the superior race" anyone?
To quote Jerry Seinfeld "In the end, we're all rooting for laundry."*
When did Nat'l Review say this, who said it, and what is Nat'l Review's official position on this now even if they did say it?
What, I'm not ever gonna vote Democrat because the KKK were a bunch of Democrats?
*for those who don't get the reference, it was a Jerry Seinfeld bit about people who root for a specific ball team for decades. Years pass, the players change, the owners change, there's no part of the team that's "original". We are in essence, rooting for a uniform with a logo on it.
|4.10.07 @ 6:33PM|#
Son of a!: Correct. Please drink.
|4.10.07 @ 6:38PM|#
"Loose shoes, tight pussy and a warm place to shit". That's all I need in this ol' world
|4.10.07 @ 6:45PM|#
No, Mo, you often convince yourself, and often errantly, that you can tell, with something approximating precision the degree to which a a person is a racist (and make no mistake, everybody is a racist, at least in some miniscule way), by the context and how they said things and how they react after getting called out. It's a very complicated matter, peering into the souls of most people, since the Hitlers and Martin Luther Kings are rare indeed, albeit on opposite sides of the spectrum. I don't care what happens to Imus, and agree that his remarks were vile, but youthinks you know more than you actually do.
Ron Hardin|4.10.07 @ 7:03PM|#
It's not about race at all. Remember Anita Hill?
It got the same media buzz as the Rutgers press conference. It's soap opera, for their
target audience.
A woman, a delicate flower who had until then been only the fragile envelope of a fine
soul, is exposed to a male idea.
Press hysteria ensues.
As for Imus, the orginal was entirely unremarkable and just part of the general
noise level that makes up sports on the Imus in the morning show. Not even a joke,
but a formal place holder for a joke.
(The joke, in sports, is that he gives rodeo scores, he gives NASCAR scores, and
he gives ugliness scores, with the same timing that self-important sports-all-the-time
shows do, as if sports were important and not about keeping you hyped up and tuned in.
Imus wobbles the story line. There's the joke.)
Imus being a fan of black preachers from way back, is vulnerable to black preachers,
and convinced now that he has made an egregious mistake. Thus giving black women
in particular no credit for being capable adults, but the helpless victims he always
prefers. Every charity he works in, and he works, and hard, in a lot of them, has
helpless victims. He loves them.
But it makes him a horrible leftist weenie, and slowly the show is turning into a
hopeless mess of pap, as various topics become off limits one after another.
The most interesting idea, actually, comes from noticing that on Tuesday, one day
before the vile nappyword was uttered over the public airwaves, Hillary had been told
(via Donald Trump) by producer McGuirk that there's no way Hillary will ever be on the
program, period.
It's interesting because the trouble Imus is in with his management is WAY out of character
for his management, completely off the wall.
It is not out of character for the Clintons, however.
I wonder if they leaned on somebody.
As I say, though, the race angle has become a sideshow to the girl soap opera.
Garth|4.10.07 @ 7:36PM|#
For all those who do not remember, the National Review used to be a bastion for White Power nonsense (not that they called it that):
http://www.amren.com/009issue/009issue.html
But that WAS some time ago... So I doubt that it has much contemporary relevance.
|4.10.07 @ 7:41PM|#
ron hardin, you're a troglodyte and a moron.
i don't know what your deal is; maybe you went through a bad divorce, or your big sister used to make you wear her clothes, or what... but your seething contempt of women is some stupid-ass shit.
|4.10.07 @ 7:54PM|#
There is such a thing as context and it does make a difference (which is why I grant no credence to squawk radio right-wingers who say Imus's African-American critics are all hypocrites, because "after all, blacks use the 'N-word' too...").
That being said, it's a fine line to walk and you'd damn well better know what you're doing. And sorry: invoking Lenny Bruce is a copout. Bruce knew what he was doing; that doesn't mean you do.
|4.10.07 @ 7:56PM|#
When did Nat'l Review say this, who said it, and what is Nat'l Review's official position on this now even if they did say it?
It was back in the late 50's, early '60s. And as far as I can tell, their position on it now is to avoid mentioning it. But you can probably find the articles reproduced on the net if you want to take the time to look. Here's one example I was able to dig up on a quick search. I believe it was written by Bill Buckley himself.
|4.10.07 @ 8:05PM|#
Sorry Will, but just because everyone's a little racist and the Hitlers are few and far between doesn't mean that people don't hold some vile views. While I cannot glimpse into the souls of others and some people come off better or worse than they are, I consider myself a reasonably good judge of character.
Of course, one can't always be right about how racist, intelligent, talented, etc. another person is, there are often signs. I find it interesting that you chide me for my certainty of judging the intent and biases of people, that, for the most part, I interact on a very regular basis. However, you seem certain that I am wrong and unable to judge another person's character when you have never met me.
Ron Hardin|4.10.07 @ 8:09PM|#
Jim Walsh,
Fascinating. Where do you get seething contempt, just out of curiosity.
Ron Hardin|4.10.07 @ 8:11PM|#
correction, Mr. Stephen Crane.
The authors are absolutely symmetric above and below in my browser, and could go either way I see.
|4.10.07 @ 8:11PM|#
I've heard a joke that compares babies to bms, 'how long does a woman's bm take? 9 months'
|4.10.07 @ 8:53PM|#
Was it a racist comment? Perhaps. Imus could just be a dick calling names; I don't know what's in the man's heart. Fortunately we have self-important gasbags like Sharpton et al. (you too joe), the proverbial canaries, waiting to faint when appropriate. The racists litmus.
|4.10.07 @ 8:53PM|#
What happened to my "Everyone's a Little Bit Racist" post? Are we suddenly not allowed to post song lyrics now?
|4.10.07 @ 9:13PM|#
Well, mo, unless you are the inventor of the ol' charact-o-meter, or perhaps the finely calibrated race-o-scope, I think it is pretty damned near impossible to judge another person's chracter. Can't be done. What can be done is observe behavior and make wild assed guesses, and given human limitations, that's what we are left with. Because this is all that is possible, however, doesn't mean we should lie to ourselves regarding the precision of the measurement we are taking. Yes, I've never met you, but I'm still willing to place a large wager that you don't know the value of pi to 500 places, no matter how good a memory you think you have, or how adept at calculation you think you are.
|4.10.07 @ 10:34PM|#
Did you to go U of R, by any chance?
What gave it away? The "bunch of drunken country-club halfwits"?
|4.10.07 @ 11:02PM|#
See Will, I disagree. Unlike memorizing pi to 500 digits (which had nothing to do with calculations and everything to do with memory and a lack of anything else better to do), humans are adept at picking up subtle tones and emotions behind words. It's why mothers have their intuition and why people generally can tell if they're being lied to. It may not be blatant, but undertones of scorn and distaste can be picked up. I don't claim to have supernatural ability, but it's relatively easy to tell when someone is saying something jokingly and when someone is saying something with scorn.
|4.10.07 @ 11:44PM|#
I neither think people are so sensitive that the words Tattoo, nappy, and hos are worth the hollering, nor that Imus is so insensitive that he thought it was funny to make fun of this team. As far as 'You People' bothering Sharpton, I'll say that the word "Sharpton" bothers me. I'd like to see Imus, Sharpton, and Jesse all go away for good from the public eye. At least none of the three are the father of Anna Nicole's baby.
|4.11.07 @ 12:19AM|#
I've got it. Sharpton vs. Imus in a UFC match. Give them sharp knives and let them go. First one to die loses. Same with the second one to die. Everyone else wins.
|4.11.07 @ 12:21AM|#
Can I assume that the troop surge is going well (and cancer is cured, etc.), because this story has completely taken over every media outlet.
|4.11.07 @ 1:52AM|#
Yeah, mo, and people make miscalculations regarding such things, epecially with strangers, with a great deal of frequency. Ever spend much time in bars? Trust me. You aren't as good a judge of a stranger's character as you think. Nobody is, which is why con men have such an easy time with their marks.
Cesar|4.11.07 @ 1:54AM|#
"What gave it away? The "bunch of drunken country-club halfwits"?"
Pretty much. Of course I can't say much, Im from Virginia Commonwealth University. We are basically a bunch of drunken art student halfwits, and our most famous alumnii are the members of GWAR.
Jewish guy|4.11.07 @ 2:03AM|#
It's the conspiracy fucks who aren't trying to be funny who are really offensive
Todd Frye|4.11.07 @ 8:05AM|#
Okay. Did I miss something? Was there something else Imus said that I missed, or is that it?
'Nappy-headed ho's' is what we've got to work with? Okay. Well, 'ho's', or so I thought, was contemporary slang for girls - not terribly appealing, and not something to approve of, but commonly used among lower-class youth.
The insult, then, must lie in the 'nappy' part. Um... black people's hair IS 'nappy,' right? One could argue it's racist to bring it up but, still, it's an accurate description of something. Is it only an acceptable word - like 'nigger' - if it's black people who use it? Do groups get to own a word?
Good God, Imus could have said any one of hundreds of other things that would have been far more racist. 'Nappy-headed ho's' is mild, and though he seems to have contempt for his subjects, it's not exactly against the law to have contempt for some group of people, especially in sports.
And, once again, let me point out that if the girls' team were Southern instead of black, Imus could have called them 'toothless' or something similar, and we would never have heard a word about the incident. So, why is one group so sacred and the other isn't?
|4.11.07 @ 8:44AM|#
Will Allen, maybe you're not as good a judge of mo's character as you think you are :)
Intuition does exist, and it is valuable.
|4.11.07 @ 9:37AM|#
I want Jeff Foxworthy to apologize for all the times he's insulted me. Where's the media outrage there? They give him a new show and let him host the country music awards. I'm hoping some of my country loving cousins take some good, ripe tomatoes to the broadcast.
|4.11.07 @ 9:45AM|#
When I was at GWU, the College Republicans didn't talk like that. That was what Young Americans for Freedom and the Politically Incorrect Student Society (PISS, get it?) were for.
"Averege clique of college Republicans" seems a bridge too far. Then again, maybe he's talking about different colleges.
|4.11.07 @ 9:51AM|#
"Black babies = bowel movements? Never heard that one."
I have, several times. Comments along the lines of "welfare mothers shitting out babies."
Paul,
National Review - Buckley himself! - penned the "superior race" line in a pro-segregation, anti-civil rights essay in the 60s. National Review has never apologized for the remark, issued a retraction, or even explicitly renounced the position and stated the opposite.
All through the civil rights movement, National Review - and Buckley himself, even after his noble work opposing antisemitism - was openly opposed to desegregation, and they have never published a word stating that they disagree, or have changed their minds.
eb|4.11.07 @ 10:03AM|#
I'd hate for people to miss the point of the column over a throwaway insult that was funny at 3 a.m., so I've asked for the change before this molehill becomes a mountain.
Were you trying to be ironic by putting a stupidly insulting assertion in this story? By all measures it was more offensive than anything Imus said.
I don't care for Imus but this whole thing is silly. Yesterday I heard somebody on the radio talking about how damaged the basketball players will be after this. I'll go out on a limb and suggest that no matter what might be said in public, none of them will lose a second of sleep over it. Unless of course the media firestorm finally convinces them that they should be devastated.
|4.11.07 @ 10:06AM|#
Green mamba, I never asserted it didn't exist, or was without value. I asserted that there was a huge body of evidence to suggest it was not especially accurate. Human history and experience is rife with all manner of misunderstanding of intent, leading to all manner of still greater folly, especially when it involves people who are unfamiliar with each other. People peer into each other's souls about as well as they assess risk; sometimes well, but quite often with a tremendous amount of inaccuracy.
VM|4.11.07 @ 10:15AM|#
"By all measures it was more offensive than anything Imus said. "
gag me with a spoon. barf out. like totally. Not.
*passes some chaez whiz fer his whine.
shockcorridor|4.11.07 @ 10:38AM|#
There's a treaure trove in the King of the Hill episode when Chris Rock plays Roger the Def-Ensive Driving School comedian. After Khan yuks it up merrily to every "white people ain't got no butt" joke Roger says the worst thing on the road is "DWO - driving while Oriental." and Khan yells out "Cheap shot! Cheap shot!"
Later Bobby gathers material from the white supremacist website for his standup debut and goes onstage and tells a joke from the "slavery days of yore."
|4.11.07 @ 10:41AM|#
I must have missed the important college republican meetings, because in my 3 years as a CR I never heard anything overtly racist. Maybe that's a result of being in a well-to-do North Eastern private institution, but isn't the "Republicans are closet racists" canard getting a little old? New punchline, please.
Marty B.|4.11.07 @ 1:24PM|#
"Were you trying to be ironic by putting a stupidly insulting assertion in this story?"
It was more that I was stepping into the hyperbolic persona I have on my blog, which has an occasional "A New Day, a New Reason to Hate Republicans" segment, but I realized that it looked a little awkward on the Reason site instead of my personal one.
Also, from a rhetoric perspective, I temporarily forgot that you score points by going after the extremists, not the moderates, so I was setting myself up to get crucified.
Anyway, it was wrong to say that Republicans are all racists; many of them only hate gay people. (Ha! Ha! Just kidding! Kind of!)
|4.12.07 @ 12:25AM|#
I actually think it's much simpler than what Beckerman says. The real problem is in who the I-man chose to attack. Slamming the Rutgers team (who had done nothing to deserve such an attack) puts him in the role of bully. The real lesson here is to pick on someone your own size.
george w bush\'s mama|4.13.07 @ 1:58AM|#
why is everyone pretending that they havent heard of white patriarchal capitalist bigots..........not only limted to the southern redneck variety.....tell a joke about black women and the birth of their children........?.....get your head out of your asses.....you that say you never have heard of it or something similar are probably the firsts to release nigger under your breath when someone black pisses you off....but of course you have a black friend and you dont think he was shat out of his mother so your not racist.
.......i must say though......marty b.'s eagerness to remind us all of the this offensive kind of talk (the bm bullshit) is a little bit questionable........whats really behind the mask of white boy satirical/trying to be funny rhetoric...?......
as for imus..........eff that greasy wet dog smelling headed ho....he and his co hosts didnt even know what spike lee movie they were referencing after he made the so called "joke"....thats crime number 2.