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|4.14.06 @ 9:40AM|#
Both........ sides........... the........... same........... so................... very..................... tired........................
|4.14.06 @ 9:40AM|#
(Stands up, yells at screen): Cathy, no! Don't do it! Don't go in there!
Shhhhhh!!!!
Larry A|4.14.06 @ 10:07AM|#
Well, I remember both 1955 and 1975, and I don't want to go back to either one.
IMO the "problems" of women who hold high power executive positions and can afford nannies and those who choose to raise their own kids supported by a husband pale in significance to the single mom who must work two jobs to take home, after taxes, 80% of what she needs to support herself and her kids.
|4.14.06 @ 10:33AM|#
There is just a certain sort of person who looks at people with a choice and says, "but what if they choose wrong?" This sort of person exists everywhere on the political spectrum, from the Rightist concerned that people will choose to be less religious or patriotic, to the Leftist concerned that people will choose less socially beneficial options like buying SUVs or smoking, to the neo-Libertarian concerned that people are choosing to vote the wrong way or live under the wrong sort of government (but only people in other countries -- we'd never try to take that away from Americans!).
All these people are the problem. Wherever on the political spectra, this horror of choice is a cancer on politics. Choice-phobics screwing up every advance of human liberty from technology to social organization to economics has long since ceased to be news.
Is the story here that the choice-phobes have infiltrated modern feminism? That's hardly news. It's right up there with "feminists breathe oxygen" in newsworthiness.
|4.14.06 @ 10:46AM|#
"the firefight between feminists and stay-at-home moms."
Shouldn't that be "catfight"?
Oooh, feminists are just so durn *cute*!
|4.14.06 @ 11:16AM|#
Too much misogyny here, I'm going to another thread. Maybe I'll go to the one about Margaret Thatcher.
|4.14.06 @ 11:26AM|#
I (a male) am taking applications to marry a well-off executive woman who will allow me to stay at home and take care of the kids. I'll require only a broadband internet connection, a gym membership (to keep myself in shape for you, dear), a plasma TV (with HBO) and a maid. You will be free to pursue a "meaningful" life of work and satisfy your obligations (as defined by Hirshman) to yourself, feminism, and society at large and I will be freed from a life of workplace drudgery that you seem so keen on attaining. So everyone wins.
|4.14.06 @ 11:43AM|#
IRC, Denmark
The Netherlands:
http://www.expatica.com/source/site_article.asp?subchannel_id=1&story_id=28628&name=Penalise%20educated%20stay-at-home%20women%20-%20PvdA
"A highly-educated woman who chooses to stay at home and not to work - that is destruction of capital," Dijksma said. "If you receive the benefit of an expensive education at the cost of society, you should not be allowed to throw away that knowledge unpunished."
Too much misogyny here,
Conflating feminists with women is like, well, inappropriate conflation.
|4.14.06 @ 11:57AM|#
In other words, Grant, there is a certain type of person who thinks that some things are better than other things, and that people who choose that which they consider worse are making a wrong decision. And, to top it off, these people have the temerity to actually talk about it. Because if you criticize some of the choices some people make, you're criticizing the very concept of choice.
Damn, libertarianism can be oppressive.
|4.14.06 @ 12:08PM|#
I have a good idea: everybody mind their own damn business.
|4.14.06 @ 12:21PM|#
WLM,
"I (a male) am taking applications to marry a well-off executive woman ... So everyone wins."
Welcome to my life.
I'm serious. I stay at home with the kid while my wife works at her computer geek job. It's not all it's cracked up to be.
|4.14.06 @ 12:53PM|#
Todd, I'm with ya. The whole stay-at-home mom vs. working-outside-the-home mom debate has started to sound like a cheesegrater on my eardrums. Do whatever the hell you want, people! Raise your children however you see fit! Someone's always going to complain. Either you have too many kids or not enough, or you should be working outside the home or not. You just can't let a bunch of meddlesome busybodies weigh too heavily in your decision-making.
|4.14.06 @ 1:07PM|#
Too many people want to be validated for the choices they've made about their lives and feel insulted by others who may prefer to do things differently. I'm not sure why it seems to be a particularly feminine problem.
|4.14.06 @ 1:17PM|#
Joe,
Libertoids believe that everyone should have no choice but to embrace choice. There can be no option but choice :)
|4.14.06 @ 6:19PM|#
I can't figure out why there are so many people who think a career is the epitome of human existence. Read a little Epicurus and get over it! Work sucks!
I, for one, look forward to the day when nanobots do all the work and I can play all day! Until then, I'd be very happy if my wife became a world-beating CEO or something and let me take care of the housework.
I'm all for equality, but some feminists are so amazingly stupid.
|4.14.06 @ 6:58PM|#
The eternal paradox. We want people to be free to choose, but then we are not prepared when their choice pisses us off.
Case in point the Palestinian election. It was a democratic election, the way we wanted, wasn't it? But turns out the bad guys won...
I think that a little less naivete about people's propensities to choose spectacularly wrong would be in order.
Think of it this way: you are in a high rise who does not allow any pets. You want to bring in your cat, and you lobby for a change tht will allow people to bring any animal they choose.
Most of them bring dogs or cats. But one decides to bring in a cobra which manages to escape...
There could be a lot of blame-throwing, but much heartache could have been saved is they had tightenend the language as to what pets can be allowed and which ones not.
|4.14.06 @ 8:32PM|#
"...you are in a high rise who does not allow any pets. You want to bring in your cat, and you lobby for a change tht will allow people to bring any animal they choose."
I say keep the animals out. Homo Sapiens are animal enough for anybody.
|4.15.06 @ 3:41AM|#
Read a little Epicurus and get over it!
|4.15.06 @ 8:03AM|#
wayne:
Bombon, my cat, is very offended by your post. Since she is a delicious creature who wakes me up by curling on my chest and purring every morning, and you are not, I am siding with her.
|4.15.06 @ 11:45AM|#
Adriana,
Having been to Korea, I will agree that cats are delicious if prepared correctly.
I am willing to wake you up every morning with a pat on the ass and the admonition that, "somebody needs to get up and make some coffee". I don't purr very well, but I snore like a Freightliner riding the jake brake on a 7% decline. Does that qualify?
|4.15.06 @ 12:55PM|#
wayne:
Sorry buddy, Bombon wins hands (or is it paws) down.
|4.15.06 @ 1:40PM|#
Denmark is not the Netherlands.
Viking Moose demonstrates his vast store of esoteric knowledge. When VM manages to figure out the "woman" and "feminist" are not the same thing, I'll be even more impressed.
Here's a hint: it's kinda like the difference between, oh, "people" and "communists." I know ideas like "subsets" are complicated, but you'll get the idea eventually.
|4.15.06 @ 2:05PM|#
"Sorry buddy, Bombon wins hands (or is it paws) down."
Adriana,
I think I should make it clear that this is an expiring offer. Of course, you will have to get rid of Bombon. That is a pretty sissy name for a predator, by the way.
|4.15.06 @ 6:18PM|#
wayne:
sorry, offer not accepted.
I'll keep Bombon and get rid of you.
|4.15.06 @ 9:54PM|#
Mur --
You claim that "[w]omen today spend twice as much time on housework as men�but 30 years ago, they did six times as much" as a result of "the home-labor-saving devices invented by men which made feminism possible."
The amount of time women spend doing housework was reduced by devices invented by men, but the shift in the proportion of work done by each gender is not controlled by that factor.
Perhaps you are implying that the reduction in women's traditional workload brought about by labor-saving devices gave them the free-time to demand free-dom. That is to a certain extent true, but it can hardly be considered a terribly meaningful fact: men didn't invent vacuums to help women out, they did it to make money.
|4.15.06 @ 10:06PM|#
Adriana,
OK. I just hope it doesn't get out that I was thrown over for a homosexual cat.
VM|4.16.06 @ 12:56PM|#
"Denmark is not the Netherlands.
Viking Moose demonstrates his vast store of esoteric knowledge. When VM manages to figure out the "woman" and "feminist" are not the same thing, I'll be even more impressed."
why, thank you.
now you know there's a difference, too. good for you. as stated earlier: i hope the rest of your thoughts are as clear. but since you did fuck that one up, are *you* sure you know the differences about which you're speaking?
staggering. very staggering. can you make a muscle for me?
|4.16.06 @ 2:43PM|#
Hey, I know how to solve this and all other issues: I'll write about it. It's the only way, really. Thanks in advance for sending me money.
Larry A|4.17.06 @ 1:39AM|#
Joe: In other words, Grant, there is a certain type of person who thinks that some things are better than other things, and that people who choose that which they consider worse are making a wrong decision. And, to top it off, these people have the temerity to actually talk about it. Because if you criticize some of the choices some people make, you're criticizing the very concept of choice.
Actually, the problem I have is not with people who criticize what they consider bad choices. It's the folks who start out, "There ought to be a law against <bad choice>."