New at Reason

Tim Cavanaugh | September 21, 2005

President Bush may be running up the deficit but at least he's not spending like LBJ, right? Right: As Nick Gillespie discovers, he's spending more than LBJ.

Comments

|9.21.05 @ 4:58PM|#

good discvovering, nick.

MP|9.21.05 @ 5:01PM|#

This article, using the quote "must pay" (although no original quote with that phrase is offered), shows Bush's complete disregard for fiscal restraint.

What's most interesting is the Stafford Act referenced in the article clearly outlines all authorizations as being discrtionary (note the heavy use of "may").

According to my three second read of the legislation, the 75% figure is the level that the President can use to get the states to pitch in by saying "if we, the Feds, are going to pay for this, you have to chip in, potentially up to 25%". It is typical DC spin-doctoring that transforms this to must pay 75%.

Disgusting.

Ugly John|9.21.05 @ 5:04PM|#

More Bush-bashing from the so-called "REASON" site:

"come by way of the American Enterprise Institute's Veronique de Rugy, who has calculated that George W. Bush has boosted total inflation-adjusted discretionary spending in his first term by 35.1 percent."

Has the French de Rugy considered that we're AT WAR? Do you think THAT might explain why President George W. Bush has had to spend more money to keep the country going. Never mind that LBJ didn't have to worry about a war or a hurricane or inflation--just keep up the attacks on President Bush, guys. Great job--NOT!

|9.21.05 @ 5:07PM|#

Get ready for Round 2 of how Bush's "small government" administration failed another batch of hurricane victims.

|9.21.05 @ 5:10PM|#

Ah, where are the Clintons of yesteryear?

MP|9.21.05 @ 5:11PM|#

Never mind that LBJ didn't have to worry about a war

I don't frequent powerline, but if the posters/commenters are really so stupid as to toss out a statement like that (uhh...Vietnam, anyone), then I guess I'm not missing much.

And BTW, Ugly Johnboy, who started that GWB's very expensive war?

|9.21.05 @ 5:12PM|#

war is the health of the state -- I am shocked and bewildered that the size of government has gone up in a republican adminstration -- not

|9.21.05 @ 5:13PM|#

And lets not forget Bush Jr's assinine tax breaks for what percentage of the population again?

MP|9.21.05 @ 5:13PM|#

And don't give me any "Vietnam wasn't a "war" under LBJ's budget" crap either.

|9.21.05 @ 5:14PM|#

"Hence, beyond any immediate aid, a raft of Great Society-ish programs for the region, ranging from a massive "Opportunity Zone," covering parts of Alabama, Mississippi, and Louisiana; an "Urban Homesteading Act;" and massive spending on roads, railroads, and other infrastructure."

The President seems to think that Americans need to feel like this kind of thing will never happen again. ...just like terrorist attacks. And President Bush, just like Johnson, needs an umbrella name for all these packages.

...I think I'll call it the "The Scared Society".

|9.21.05 @ 5:16PM|#

Wait wait wait. I didn't catch that part. Ugly John actually claimed that LBJ didn't have a war to fight?


I think there are 50 000 dead men that would contest that claim.

|9.21.05 @ 5:20PM|#

I think Ugly John is being sarcastic.

But from some of the visits that we get you can never be sure.

|9.21.05 @ 5:21PM|#

Never mind that LBJ didn't have to worry about a war or a hurricane or inflation--just keep up the attacks on President Bush, guys.

Let's see here:

The Viet Nam's escalation was undertaken under LBJ's watch.

The last major hurricane to hit New Orleans hit during LBJ's administration.

Just how fucking ignorant are you?

|9.21.05 @ 5:21PM|#

Ugly John,

I feel for you, buddy. The way the Right is these days, parody is nearly impossible.

You're like Dr. Evil, with his plan to blackmail the royal family with the threat of an adultery scandal.

|9.21.05 @ 5:24PM|#

The President seems to think that Americans need to feel like this kind of thing will never happen again. ...just like terrorist attacks. And President Bush, just like Johnson, needs an umbrella name for all these packages.

...I think I'll call it the "The Scared Society".

Remember when it was the "Land of the free, and the home of the brave"?

MP|9.21.05 @ 5:27PM|#

And Tim, if you're reading, I had a post with two HTML links get filtered. I'm not the first to have this happen to. I know M1EK reported this issue as well.

|9.21.05 @ 5:38PM|#

um so what does it look like when you take out defence spending?

And when is ignoring entitlement spending ever a good idea?

|9.21.05 @ 5:43PM|#

"More Bush-bashing from the so-called "REASON" site:

The use of the word "Bush-bashing" here makes it seem as if criticism of President Bush was logically impossible. ...but it isn't.

"Has the French de Rugy considered that we're AT WAR?"

Is pointing to de Rugy's Frenchness supposed to be persuasive?

"Do you think THAT might explain why President George W. Bush has had to spend more money to keep the country going."

What does being French have to do with the President's spending? How does defense spending explain the President's excessive non-defense spending?

"Never mind that LBJ didn't have to worry about a war or a hurricane or inflation--..."

There are several things wrong with this statement. ...For one, you seem to suggest that government spending is somehow the remedy for inflation!

"just keep up the attacks on President Bush, guys. Great job--NOT!"

Once again, it's as if there were no reasoning behind the criticism of President Bush. ...as if pointing out that someone was critical of President Bush somehow countered his argument!

|9.21.05 @ 5:45PM|#

joshua-

Good point on defense spending. Some people keep tabs on "non-defense discretionary spending" and I'm kind of surprised that the article didn't break it down that way.

As far as entitlements, one can argue that since Social Security and Medicare spending is (by law) tied to demographic factors, nobody should be judged based on that portion of the budget. Yeah, I know, there are holes in that argument. But probably the biggest hole is that when the size of that budget item is changed by legislation rather than demographics (e.g. adding a prescription drug entitlement) then it is entirely appropriate to factor in that portion of entitlement spending when evaluating fiscal policy.

|9.21.05 @ 5:47PM|#

Hey you critics of the President's prescription drug benefit!

...don't you know there's a war going on?

|9.21.05 @ 5:47PM|#

And BTW, Ugly Johnboy, who started that GWB's very expensive war?

Iraq did by flying planes into the WTC.

It's not like Bush had a choice in the matter.

|9.21.05 @ 5:56PM|#

joshua- you can go here to see non-defense discretionary spending. Although Bush doesn't appear to be quite as bad as LBJ, 2004 and 2005 figures are estimates.

I see that deRugy used to be at Cato. Does AEI pay more?

|9.21.05 @ 6:02PM|#

"It's not like Bush had a choice in the matter."

Again, the association between 9/11 and the Iraq War! ...It never ends.

I guess that explains why there are markets for things like green toothpaste and nipple rings.

|9.21.05 @ 6:03PM|#

Tom Crick-

I'm pretty sure that ChicagoTom was being sarcastic.

|9.21.05 @ 6:06PM|#

"I'm pretty sure that ChicagoTom was being sarcastic."

Darn! I always fall for that!

|9.21.05 @ 6:14PM|#

Hey hey GWB!
How many dollars have been wasted by thee!

B.D.|9.21.05 @ 6:28PM|#

Minor quibble: Congress passes spending bills. The President requests the spending and signs the bills (and Bush has never vetoed a bill), but Congress makes the legislation. In other words, there's plenty of blame to go around in the Republican party.

|9.21.05 @ 6:32PM|#

And the whole reason why there's so much pork and spending is that Congress knows the President will rubber stamp anything they send him.

|9.21.05 @ 6:47PM|#

Darn! I always fall for that!

Tom Crick -- Then my plan worked!! :)

But I don't get the reference to toothpaste/nipple rings

*feeling stupid*

|9.21.05 @ 6:57PM|#

National Enquirer says Bush is drinking again:

http://www.nationalenquirer.com/celebrity/63426

|9.21.05 @ 7:00PM|#

This is one instance where no one will say, "Yeah, but Kerry would have been worse."

How the hell could anyone be worse than George W. "What's a veto?" Bush.

|9.21.05 @ 7:04PM|#

"But I don't get the reference to toothpaste/nipple rings."

Marketers can created associations in peoples minds; associations that are counterintuitive.

...They can make people associate green toothpaste with whiter teeth. ...They can make people associate getting a nipple ring with... ...with whatever it is that people who get their nipples pierced associate with it...

...They can make people associate the Iraq War with 9/11... No really! I've seen it happen! ; )

|9.21.05 @ 7:07PM|#

It says something about our expectations of the level of national discourse when no sarcasm is sarcastic enough to not also sound like a completely straight-faced, serious argument.

I don't know what it says, but it says something. Possibly something in pig latin.

|9.21.05 @ 7:44PM|#

Tom Crick- I believe you're right.

There are some people who believe they're floating on Cloud 9, when they're actually sitting on a turdpile. Example

|9.21.05 @ 7:44PM|#

isildur-

The point you make leads me to think that maybe, just maybe, gaius marius is right.

*shudder*

|9.21.05 @ 8:10PM|#

Happy Jack, that is quite the turdpile.

..They can make people associate getting a nipple ring with... ...with whatever it is that people who get their nipples pierced associate with it...

Tom Crick, I have pierced nipples and, try as I might, I cannot come up with a good answer. I have no idea what I might, even in my deepest subconscious, associate nipple rings with.

I had retarded (read: fat, puffy, man-)nipples, and the piercings fixed 'em up. They are, I am glad to report, Firm & Pointed, three years later. Still working on being less fat. Hope this helps.

|9.21.05 @ 8:31PM|#

National Enquirer says Bush is drinking again

Aren't we all. Or began to, if we didn't before.

|9.21.05 @ 8:55PM|#

"I have no idea what I might, even in my deepest subconscious, associate nipple rings with."

Maybe that's the way it's supposed to be.

...Whenever a broker tells me, "There's no market for that.", I always respond, "There's a market for nipple rings!"

Happy Jack,

That guy at Red State is a dolt. ...and I bet he's proud of it.

That's what I forgot to add to the list. ...Marketers can make people associate President Bush with fiscal responsibility!

|9.21.05 @ 9:06PM|#

Tom-

There are people who think that lacking in communication skills, intellectual curiosity, and intellect is a virtue. Sadly, many of them actually vote.

|9.21.05 @ 9:27PM|#

Bush is giving us more guns and butter than LBJ did, but Bush will never use the word, "butter."
He wants to be sure he'll still be able to parachute when he's in his 80's like Dad.
He has his priorities straight.

|9.21.05 @ 9:49PM|#

Tom Crick- is there such a thing as over-marketing?

I think you're supposed to drink the Kool-Aid, not drown in it. ;)

|9.21.05 @ 10:54PM|#

Joe, I laughed so hard that I woke the baby.

Have you no shame, sir?

|9.21.05 @ 11:33PM|#

Anyone else watch that plane land in LAX? Hats off to the pilots, the engineers who designed it, etc.

|9.21.05 @ 11:51PM|#

HITLER AT THE PODIUM: We swear we are not going to abandon the struggle until the Last Jew in Europe has been exterminated and is actually dead. It is not enough to isolate the Jewish enemy of mankind -- the Jew has got to be exterminated.

JEW IN AUDIENCE: What the fuck?!

2ND JEW: I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic.

|9.21.05 @ 11:52PM|#

You're like Dr. Evil, with his plan to blackmail the royal family with the threat of an adultery scandal.

Excellent argument.

|9.22.05 @ 12:00AM|#

Hak: I'd heard nothing about that plane till you mentioned it, so thanks.

I found this link.

Includes great video. (Preceded by annoying but short advertisement.)

|9.22.05 @ 12:31AM|#

More Bush-bashing from the so-called "REASON" site

Oh noooo! We've got a Republispambot in our midst!

|9.22.05 @ 12:39AM|#

Stevo Darkly,

We watched it live and started cheering when the plane came to a stop. Post-Katrina and pre-Rita it was a nice feeling to have. :)

|9.22.05 @ 1:12AM|#

That was one hell of a pilot.

|9.22.05 @ 1:16AM|#

poco,

We should mate joe and Ugly John. :)

|9.22.05 @ 1:50AM|#

Stevo:

Alas, that video requires I watch it in IE. MSNBC is truly evil.

|9.22.05 @ 2:36AM|#

BTW, fuck Rita.

|9.22.05 @ 3:42AM|#

jf:

I don't know if it also requires IE, but there is also a video at cnn.com. But MSNBC's is better and more dramatic, IMO.

|9.22.05 @ 7:30AM|#

More Bush-bashing from the so-called "REASON" site:

Sheesh! Is there nothing Dubbya can do that the Right will see how him for the fool that he is? Big spending was horrendus when it was spent on "midnight basketball" and a minor military set to in Serbia, but it's A-OK for welfare giveaways to churches (i.e. "faith based initiatives) and stirring up foreign policy hornets nests in the Middle East.

Never mind that LBJ didn't have to worry about a war...

Peter: You know that whole Vietnam thing? Never happened.
Brian: Oh yeah, but don't mention it around the Veterans Hospital. Those guys are really committed to the lie.

|9.22.05 @ 7:37AM|#

Tom Crick writes: "That guy at Red State is a dolt. ...and I bet he's proud of it."

That guy at Red State sounds like someone who's refinanced his mortgage a few times lately, and has decided that the Federal government can run on similar lines. Never repay the national debt, just keep refinancing it.

|9.22.05 @ 8:01AM|#

Stevo-

I figured ChicagoTom was being sarcastic because it didn't fit with his previous posts. I figured that Ugly John was being sarcastic because of his line about LBJ not having a war to worry about. Not even the Bushbots are that stupid...um, wait, never mind.

But ChicagoTom was definitely being sarcastic. He even said so later.

|9.22.05 @ 8:12AM|#

Jesus Christ, I have a hard enough time getting into a flying can, and have to hear stories like that recent development.

Grown men where crying in that plane? I can think of hundreds of much more painful deaths I would rather go through. I fucking HATE flying.

MP|9.22.05 @ 8:36AM|#

BTW, fuck Rita.

I did.

|9.22.05 @ 8:57AM|#

This is one instance where no one will say, "Yeah, but Kerry would have been worse."

Ha. That's like saying "this is one discussion on global politics where nobody will invoke Godwin's Law" or "this is one reality show that nobody will watch." You think that twit at redstate.org linked to above would hesitate for half a second before agreeing that Bush is better than Kerry in every conceiveable manner, even if he is ostensibly worse?

With the "Kerry woulda been worse" Bush apologists, the bar keeps moving. You no longer have a static standard; you have a static subject. And the standard shifts to conform to whatever the subject does or says. So, even if Bush raped baby kitties on top of a pile of dead Katrina victims, the idiots like those at Powerline and redstate.org would say "well, see, Bush understands kitten raping, and he's doing it in a way that honors the victims of Katrina." His performing an action is enough to justify it. So, no matter what, if Kerry would have done it differently than Bush, better or worse, it would have been worse.

|9.22.05 @ 10:05AM|#

I can sum up Bush's spending habits in 2 words. Drunken Sailor.

|9.22.05 @ 10:20AM|#

I'm offended, at least I'm spending my own money.

And I spend my money on good booze and respectable hookers, not boondoggles and shameless political whores.

|9.22.05 @ 10:39AM|#

Mr. Nice Guy: think they'll have to replace some of those seats (the upholstery, anyway)?

|9.22.05 @ 10:44AM|#

Pssttt. George. I'm here and willing to provide numbness.

|9.22.05 @ 11:35AM|#

MP,

You must have a huge cock. The eye of that storm is pretty big. :)

gaius marius|9.22.05 @ 11:50AM|#

Has the French de Rugy considered that we're AT WAR?

lol -- for some, even aei's flacks aren't sufficiently loyal to the holy american emperor anymore. what a rabid mob this president has attracted!

gaius marius|9.22.05 @ 11:56AM|#

It says something about our expectations of the level of national discourse when no sarcasm is sarcastic enough to not also sound like a completely straight-faced, serious argument.

it says, imo, mr isildur, that the cultural dialectic has descended beyond even irony into the absurd. as jane said: nothing's shocking!

*shudder*

huddle for warmth, mr thoreau. :)

B.D.|9.22.05 @ 12:10PM|#

I'd rather educate Rita.

|9.22.05 @ 12:30PM|#

"America is committed to the defense of South Vietnam until an honorable peace can be negotiated," Johnson told the Tennessee Legislature on March 15, 1967. Despite the obstacles to victory, the president said, "We shall stay the course."

After 14 Marines died in a roadside bombing on Aug. 3, Bush declared: "We will stay the course, we will complete the job in Iraq. And the job is this: We'll help the Iraqis develop a democracy."

|9.22.05 @ 12:44PM|#

poco:

it Depends.. (heh heh)

|9.22.05 @ 12:44PM|#

I'd rather educate Rita.

DB,

I'd be careful. Rita is a man, baby!

|9.22.05 @ 12:45PM|#

Why anyone expected something different from a guy who made his pile from direct taxpayer subsidy is beyond me, but before LBJ is ranked better, let's give proper crdit to the central planner who created Medicare, as opposed to the central planner who expanded it to cover more drug costs.

As awful as Bush spending habits have been, and they have been awful, it is not he who has been the major force in transforming the primary activity of our national government to be the transfer of wealth from the young to the old, without regard to need.

|9.22.05 @ 3:25PM|#

I'm surprised that Gaius hasn't mentioned political religion yet. That old chestnut was always one of my favorites.;)

Dave W.|9.22.05 @ 3:33PM|#

it is not he who has been the major force in transforming the primary activity of our national government to be the transfer of wealth from the young to the old, without regard to need.

I beg to differ. Founded in 1919, Halliburton has 50 years on me.